When Did You Realize That Those Complicated Memories Were of Abuse?

When Did You Realize That Those Complicated Memories Were of Abuse?
J

Josh1

Registrant
I have never really not remembered my abuse; it started when I was fifteen and lasted for over three years -- I wasn't young enough for the abuse memories to fade into forgotten memories of childhood But up until much more recently in my life when I began disclosing to more people and visiting Male Survivor did I began to see "that relationship" as more than a bunch of complicated experiences, to see them definitively as psycho-sexual abuse.

I am curious about when others began to (a) remember the experiences you now refer to as abuse and (b) when you began to identify them as abuse -- if at a different time.

Another question I have is how many people have felt empowered to call their experiences abuse and to talk more openly because of the publicity surrounding the church scandal? This question arises partially from noticing that I have met quite a few men here at MS who are in their forties, fifties, sixties.

I am in my twenties, but I am not sure I would have been able to confront and label my abuse without the leadership of other, many older, men who are screaming at society that it has to stop ignoring us. Society's male stereotypes of strength, power, and independance were some of my perp's greatest allies.

I think that a lot of the feeling of empowerment that has allowed me to recognize my experiences as abuse and to disclose more publicly has been awakened by the men on this site who have lead the way in saying that there are no ifs, ands, or abuse, those experiences I used to think of simply as "complicated" really were abuse (period).

I am so curious to hear others' thoughts.

Josh
 
Josh, I always remembered. I did not disclose until I was in my 40s. I wish I had disclosed much earlier. Peace, Andrew
 
Josh - I wish that someone had noticed when I was abused. My personality and appearance changed fairly rapidly, but that was 1969!

The swinging sixties...I didn't have a clue what swinging was then, I didn't even have a clue what sex was then (Iwas only just turned 12). I didn't know what grooming was, and that some perverted men groomed young boys so that they could eventually sexualise them ! I didn't know what 'sexualise was'. I didn't know what sex was....in any form!!!

Why did a 32 year old man/pervert think it was OK to do those things???

Talking about empowerment to talk about the abuse... I hope you've read some of my recent posts!

Josh - dealing with the problem now whilst you are in your 20's must be a good thing. I must have been 45 (or there abouts) the first time I told. That means that you have so much more time to put this behind you, and put it into the context that it belongs. The abusers should carry the guilt, not us!

Empowerment - yesterday I went to court expecting to see the pervert that abused me jailed! He asked to withdraw his guilty plea! My friend that went with me was livid - it was really no less than I expected!

In the witness protection house, before the case was presented in court, I was talking to one of the volunteers that I have built up a repartee with. I told her a few things that my friend didn't know...he kept turning away and looking out of the window..he was wiping his eyes & thinking that I hadn't noticed!

It wasn't what I was saying that upset him, it was the fact that I was standing there telling someone about what had happended, and the fact that I was no longer ashamed about it. So maybe I am now empowered through speaking out.

Sorry I'm ranting a bit at the moment because I am fired up and seeking justice!

Best wishes ...Rik
 
Thank you, Andrew and Rick, for your honesty and for sharing.

Andrew, did you always think of what you remembered as abuse? For me, my process of disclosure has brought me to think about my experiences very differently. I am curious whether it is that way for you, too.

Rick, I have been reading some of your posts and am proud of your confrontation process. New York's f!@$%*d up s.o.l laws are preventing me from taking legal action.

An additional question for both of you and anyone else. Which came first: disclosure or recognition that it was abuse/criminal/wrong?

I really mean what I said in my first post. I think so much of my ability to disclose now rather than 20 years later is that survivors such as you through speaking out have been changing the public conscious and letting it be known that it is okay to remember, see it as abuse, and to talk out.

Thank you,

Josh
 
As far as I can tell, I have no repressed memories.

I've always remembered the events that happened to me. However, I would simply shelf those memories and not consider them more than weird, undesirable events, taking them "off the shelf" once in a while to look them over, then put them back again. I never called them abuse. It took talking to a T in 1998 to give them their proper place and label. The events have always been abuse. I just never saw them as such until in the last 10 years.

FT
 
Josh - the first time that I realised that something was wrong, was the last time that I met the perp by arrangement all those years ago!

I live in an old railway town (actually the birth of the railways) - the grooming process (to cut the story short) began with rifles (22 slug guns) and progressed to 'games'. These were 'activites that everyone did, but no one talked about'. He was one lying b******!

The last time I saw him (pre-arranged), we were stood next to a water tank that was used for filling up the boilers on steam trains! Suddenly he told me to stand still and say nothing! A local policeman was walking along the path about 15 yards away!

I couldn't understand why I had to be silent and not move, when everyone did this! That's when it dawned on me how stupid I had been! I was in shock and obviously didn't shout out! It took a hell of a long time after that to actually speak up! About 3 and a half decades!

I just felt so different to everyone else for such a long time after that (and still do).

When I decided to fight back, that's when things got better!

I still have to see the b****** walking around town even now - he is bailed without restriction!

I have posted here that the moment that I spoke was chosen for me, I didn't choose it!

You are right that speaking out changes the publice perception...possibly it is the last taboo!

Best wishes ..Rik
 
After my abuse I acted out for nearly 20 years thinking that it is the 'normal' way to get love, and it was not until today that I realised that what happened later on was only part of the sexualization process, I could not escape, it really was NOT my fault.

Thank you Rik, for putting a label on it, and freeing me.
 
Thank FT, Rik and Morningstar for sharing.

I think I'm trying to wrap my mind around the phenomena of MaleSurvivor.org, and the grassroots raising of social awareness that has been occurring the last decade or so.

Part of my curiosity revolves around when survivors decide to start talking, start becoming receptive to the idea that it was abuse, not jsut "weird, undesirable memories."

For me, this has been a long, complicated process, and yet there have been certain well-defined landmarks, the most recent of which being when I first came to these discussion boards and realized how not-alone I was.
 
Josh1,

I have never forgotten my abuse. I always remember it. I never disclosed it to anyone until I was in my early 40s.

The church scandal had nothing to do with it, although it definitely triggered me from time to time. The thing that hit me hard in my early 40s was my oldest son's 16th birthday. The rest of that summer, I was restless and confused. I had the nightmares again more frequently. I mulled over memories more often and could not get them out of my head. Finally, my dense self realized that I was going through all of this because I was 16 when I was raped. I guess it's sort of like living my life through my son. When he turned 16, that was all it took to trigger my rape at 16.

It was obvious enough until I had to tell my wife. Our marriage was on the skids by then due to my undisclosed SA issues. It's like everything just fell into place and I had no other choice but to face these issues and deal with them.
 
Josh,

I was abused from the age of 11 until 14 by a Scout leader who was also a big deal in our church. He was not only a pedophile but a sadist, and by the time I was 14 I was pretty badly tramatized and emotionally destroyed. Things felt worse after the abuse ended, because I actually missed the bastard and felt that now I really was all alone. By the age of about 16 I was going into a kind of denial, from which I did not start to emerge until 2000, 35 years later.

My T told me that I did not lose memories, I had simply broken them up into safe pieces and refused to think about what all the pieces meant. I am still putting things back together, and when a big section of the puzzle comes together I still get hit pretty badly by it.

When things started coming back to me, they were as fragmented memories of same-sex activity, so at first I wondered am I gay or what? I also considered the possibility that I was going insane. In reality I was desperately trying to avoid the conclusion I must have suspected all along. In November 2003 I finally gave up trying to avoid this conclusion and told my sister that I had been abused as a boy. But I kept hoping that therapy and medication would prove me wrong, and only gave up the last shreds of that hope last November, when I disclosed to my parents.

Much love,
Larry
 
From age 7 to about 15 I remembered NOTHING!Then all of a sudden when the person who raped me appeared in my life again it all came flooding back. I remember laying in my bed one morning and thinking " Something isn't right .....Something happened that wasn't normal" I remember thinking I am attracted to women and even had a crush on a girl in school at the time I was abused but I had sex with a boy.I wish I told when I was 7 but I think I blocked it out almost as soon as it happend.

I remember leaving their house early in the a.m. after it happened and not speaking with them for weeks or maybe days . I woke up and just walked out thinking feeling sick to my stomach. One thing that is weird is as a teen and adult if I passed out at someone's house drunk I allways left early in the a.m.ALWAYS!!!!
 
My first memory came back when I was about 24-25. It was just a flash, but in that instant I knew that I had been sexually abused and that the flash of memory was the tip of a really big iceberg.

I was right

Will
 
Josh When I was raped by Father R back in 1961 it was very violent because I tryed to stop him. He didn't take any time to groom me he just used his power to get what he wanted.
I stopped being an altar boy that day and every one wanted to know why I wasn't an altar boy any more. I told on Father R back then when I was 11 years old.
I was told by the church board that my story was unbeleivable and they did nolthing.
I was finnaly able to talk openly about it back in 2002.
Realy wish that I had got help back in 1961 but know that it is this site that helped me deal with it all these years later. Tom
 
I was 9 when it took place and it was one night so I have always known about it, my mother took me to the police and I told my story and that was all that took place. I was left to face the world with no mention of the molestation, no guidance from my mother or father. I went to school and felt crazy, fearful. It was a friend I went to school with (his father molested me) and in my mind I knew that everyone at school would know what I had done (that is the way I thought at 9) this set me up for a world of hurt and I had no idea until my wife had an affair. That took me into therapy, it was the last straw but I had no idea that the molestation was the root of my problems. I was trying to talk about all the mess and the counselor was trying to get to the root (the molestation) when I finally gave in and believed him that is when I began healing. I was thirty when I realized the molestation had a huge impact on my life. I really thought it had passed away but in truth it was there like a neon sign on my forehead. The power came when I gave the power back to me, the child, I became responsible for my actions when I put the responsibility on the predator for the molestation.

I hope this helps as much as it helped me in writing it out.

Thanks,
 
I came to awareness a year ago. This is when the memories and fantasies and fears made sense.

about 7 years ago I was aware that I had been abused, but life was so busy - new family and career - that I chose not to look at it.

The first time I became fully aware was during one of my panic attacks during sex. My wife stopped and asked where I was and I didn't know. Usually when that happened we'd just stop, but I said I wanted to go on. During orgasm I remembered. Right after she asked me if I had been abused and I said yes.

That's when I began to understand memories, fantasies, and feelings that seemed to haunt me like a plague. I was raped by my dad's step father from the time I was about 6 until 8.

Memories still come to me but I feel that much of what happened I protected myself by just buzzing my brain. My panic attacks during sex is like the white noise on the tv - my whole body just buzzes. I'm more comfortable when that happens now. I'm learning to give myself time and space for healing.
 
Thank you all for your incredibly beautiful posts on this topic.

I have been thinking a lot about Larry Roadrunner's question on the other thread about reaching out to/helping teams, and I think my answer is related to what initially motivated me to start this thread.

I just don't think I would have been able to take the step of recognizing my memories as an adolescent as abuse without MaleSurvivor. I knew what happened was terrible, wrong, criminal, etc... but recognizing abuse is somewhat different.

By seeing my experiences as abuse, I have been able for the first time in my recovery process to say, yes, I was a victim. Something really bad was done to me, I need the time and space to heal, and I deserve justice to be served.

I believe that the work we are doing on these message boards directly relates to increasing public awareness. Great movements do not just start, they are developed, built, start grass roots, and grow.

Everytime I disclose or bring up my abuse in conversation or let someone see my emotions and weakness, I believe that I am educating. Remembering the past is not a solo activity. Although each of our experiences occurred in such a private way, we can together remember, share, identify, and discuss. We can help each other to create a collective memory.

If we want to save kids in the long-run from the hells we were put through, our greatest weapon is discussion and remembering together. Yes, sometimes people out there don't understand, but in my mind that's all the more reason to keep talking, to demand our rights, to demand to be understood, to demand that society stop standing by in silence.

I guess my point is that all of the work everyone here on MS is doing is remarkable, and it is changing things.

Josh
 
My abuse occurred just before I turned 11. I didn't think about it constantly, but even so I had always remembered what happened; so clever were my abusers that I didn't attach any negative emotions to those memories. The abuse ended when I moved away from it; for a while after, I simply understood what had happened to be something that I had gone along with, and that had to be kept secret. I even missed it for a little while, until I just simply didn't think about it anymore and went on to other things. I knew what "sexual abuse" was, but I understood it to mean something necessarily sad, violent, or tragic, and I simply didn't connect those sorts of feelings to what happened to me.

It was just a little more than a year after I moved away, I think, that I began to revisit those memories, and my opinion about them began to morph. At first it was just a little cognitive dissonance - "ok, maybe it shouldn't have happened, but oh well". "ok, it really shouldn't have happened - kids aren't supposed to do those things, but it happened, oh well". Then I began to put more serious thought into it. Why I had gone along with it at all? Before the abusers, I didn't do anything like that; nor did I do anything like that after I moved. Something happened to make me act differently - what?

Eventually, I came to understand that what had happened really was terrible, and I had been deluding myself into thinking it wasn't. I was angry at myself, and even angrier at my former friend, whose parents were the perpetrators. Nobody likes to be shown to have played the fool, I suppose - but I hated it and was terribly angry about it.

Later on, of course, I got with it and calmed down. Took a while, though.
 
Josh,

I have never forgotten. If you are interested in my background see my introductory post in late February.

Russ
Milwaukee

(russ-milwaukee)
 
I knew it was abuse the first time it happened. A few weeks before the fist incident I watched the "A Time to Tell" video with my scout troop. I knew what my perp did to me equaled abuse but I didn't say anything to anybody for four years.
 
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