What is acting out really? Do you know before hand what you are doing?

[jaywho]

What is acting out? I am new, like 3 months knew to this hell and the thoughts of continued episodes with my husband is scaring me to death. I have a couple of post; about all of them have had a reply about this acting out stuff. Im not sure what it is or why it happens.

I think I understand it is a way to cause harm to yourself; to degrade yourself to feelings of what you experienced as a child (because you think that is all you are worthy of feeling). Other times it is different as with one gentlemen saying he acted out because his life now wasnt going well. He then acted out cause as a child the victimization gave him a sense of belonging; thus he received attention in what he thought at the time as genuine caring.

Others say in acting out it was a way they re-lived the past. Why re-live the past ever?

Do you know when you are acting out or is it later you realize you did this because of the emotion it causes?

Also in the case of acting out through sex, wouldnt you know you want to do these things and desire it? What do you get from it?

Just wondering what acting out is all about. Would like to research considering it is a large part of my pain; and looks to be my future.

Does everyone act out in someway?

Do you have intentions on doing it; do you think about it before and then act?

Not sure how to look at it. In my case I get scared thinking he did it because I was lacking something to make him feel wanted. Or; he was feeling so low he needed that extra push over the edge cause I didn't bring him up enough. Very confused!!

 

[Archnut]

Hi jaywho

Good question

I'm sure I do "act out" but in what context, I have no idea?

Regards
Archnut
"And all that was left was hope"

My Story (Triggers)
https://www.waltonhop.blogspot.com

 

[PAS]

>>>What is acting out? I am new, like 3 months knew to this hell and the thoughts of continued episodes with my husband is scaring me to death. I have a couple of post; about all of them have had a reply about this acting out stuff. Im not sure what it is or why it happens.

"Acting out" is any way that a survivor of ANY kind of abuse acts to distance themselves towards others... to recreate the abuse, etc. etc. Someting abuseive "outside" the person. Acting out can be sexual it can be physical (picking fist-fights with others) it can be verbal (picking verbal fights with others).

"Acting in" is another word often used too - where the person mentally beats up on themselves, often winds up in depressive episodes (this is my specialty).. typically but not always men have more of a habit of acting out as a response to abuse and women often act in, but as i said, there are many exceptions.

I am not sure in that context if "repeating" the degradation/abuse by seeking other ways to feel bad is acting in or out, or both... or if I've got the definitions quite right, but in any case its a type of "coping technique" that someone uses to deal with abuse - and it is definitely not the most effective or appropriate response.

One way to look at the resopnses that a survivor has to abuse is to look at the person's life as a continuum - initially during the abuse phase of a survivor's life, particularly if the person was abused continualy or had to stay in a relationship with their abuser in order to survive (i.e. if the abuser was a parent and the child's only other option was to run away and risk life on the streets) or if the survivor had to hide away what happened to them because they risked being shunned/further punished by their parents/family/social group (as in the case of my partner) they had to adapt to that difficult situation and adopt a lot of coping techniques in order to literally "survive".

They had to do things like zone out during the abuse, they had to develop tough skins and a big shield of anger to stop the hurt from getting to them, they sometimes used drugs and alcohol to numb the overwhelming feelings. Unfortunately these responses are so ingrained by the abuse in such a powerful way that survivors carry those responses with them LONG after they leave the abusive person/situation and they cannot tell the difference between the past, unsafe situation, and the current, more safe, different situation. Survivors of childhood abuse of ANY kind learn to believe the world is unsafe and you need to protect yourself by ANY means possible.

However, in a world where we need to trust in order to form mature healthy adult relationships, where we need to take risks, we need to learn to live in an uncertain world, these coping techiques are completely maladaptive. It is these responses that are now termed "acting out" and "acting in".

These are the thigns that therapy teaches the survior to change/work on in order to re-adapt to a non-abusive, non-victim state of life.

So if you can look at these behaviours as very important to allow the survivor to actually SURVIVE, but now they have to learn new behaviour and new beliefs about the world rather than something awful and horrible maybe these behaviours wont seem so scary.

>>>Others say in acting out it was a way they re-lived the past. Why re-live the past ever?

Some people try to repeatedly re-create the past in order to "claim" it and control it (never works though) and others sometimes put themselves back into a harmful or degrading or demeaning situation in order for them to create the perceived "world view" they have of themselves (i.e. my abuse has influenced me to believe I am a piece of shit therefore I must find places and people who confirm that belief - for survivors it just "feels normal" because it is what we are used to). For me I have done certain types of acting out in order to reconfirm that I am indeed the piece of crap that my past has told me that I am, simply because it is waaay easier to believe that old line than to acknowledge the anger and the reality of what actually happened to me. Self harm/self-abuse is, for some bizarre reasons, sometimes much easier than standing up and saying "HEY! What so and so did was NOT right". Mostly because I simply in my heart of hearts still do believe that I am a piece of crap and I am fighting that belief daily.

There's also the whole notion of "learned helplessness" in there too - after being abused for so long as a kid you learn to believe that ther is NOTHING you can do to help your situaion so you just give up and continue to "take it".

There are some pretty powerful psychological studies that have shown that learned helplessness in animals is someting that is difficult to overcome (there was a study done on dogs receiving electric shocks years ago). It takes a LOT of training and therapy to believe that now all of a sudden I'm an adult and I can control my fate/life whereas in the past I just had to sit and take wahtever shit was handed to me and deal with it in wahtever way I could in order to survive.

>>Do you know when you are acting out or is it later you realize you did this because of the emotion it causes?

A lot of this answer has to do with basic human biology/psychology - Unfortunately sometimes acting out is mostly in the subconscious - When the brain is responding to a perceived repetition of the trauma it can be a completely "robotic" response - the initial trauma/abuse has a way of actualy re-programmign one's mind so that in some cases, survivors do things, and they are not even conscious they are doing it... the neural pathways in the brain are literally rewired to respond ultra-fast without thinking to the next time the same situation appears to be taking shape. Its a protective mechanism thats tied into the older, less developed part of the brain that has allowed animals to survive potentially deadly experiences. We unfortunatley although are a much more highly evolved organism we still posess those "lesser developed" parts of our brain stems that have those patways etched into them.. it takes a lot to unlearn those trauma-induced reactions.

>>>Also in the case of acting out through sex, wouldnt you know you want to do these things and desire it? What do you get from it?

Acting out through sex can be just automatic and robotic as any other response... Its no different. I have heard of survivors who have completely honest and genuine feelings of love for their partner but they sought sex with prostitutes and didnt see that it had anything to do with their relationship. This is how split apart that love and sex can become in the mind of a survivor.. SA survivors had to split off their body from their minds in order to survive the ordeal, its no surprise that it will take some work to reintegrate them back together again.

What do survivors get from sexual acting out? A lot of things - recreation of the "normal state of shame" they carry around with them, prior to the "act" some survivors say it's like a big "rush" somewhat akin to a drug. Some survivors want to "pay back" to others what was done to them (treat someone else like crap sexually - that was my partner's big trick before he met me). Also my partner told me once that since the "innocence" was stolen from him early on it wasnt such a big deal to do the sexual acting out things that he did.. when one is sexually abused before they are sexually mature its as he says like going from 0 to 100 mph without a seatbelt, a drivers licence or a car.. its overwhelming and confusing and its bound to have an impact on their sexual behaviour and sexual boundaries.


>>>Just wondering what acting out is all about. Would like to research considering it is a large part of my pain; and looks to be my future.

It may or may not be - if your partner is tuned in to his abuse amd well advanced in therapy, maybe not. Also there are many kinds of acting out - there's sexual acting out, there's abusive (verbal, physical, emotoinal) acting out, there's just plain old anger rearing its ugly head...

My partner never acted out sexually when in a relationship which is a good thing - while I believe in standing by my partner, there are some things that I dont think I'd be able to put up with, and the big one for me woudl be ongoing sexual acting out, heavy duty verbal/psychological abuse or alcohol/drug abuse and using SA as an "excuse" without the survior taking responsibility for his behaviour and taking "action"..

>>Does everyone act out in someway?

I think everyone who has had some abuse experience in our pasts act out in some way. I'm a big yeller/screamer/self-harmer. It matches my past history of psychological and verbal abuse. My partner has had a history of sexual acting out and some verbal/psychological acting out due to his SA and his shame-and-guilt-about-sex-control-freak mom.

>>>Do you have intentions on doing it; do you think about it before and then act?

I have heard that it is in many instances a complete subconscious "reaction" - or at least partly a subconscious reaction.. there is not the full "thought process" involved when acting out happens. Its kind of the way an alcoholic "rationalizes" the next drink.. they just "gotta have it" or they have this overwhelming urge for this behaviour or that substance to quell the overload of feelings that they are feeling.

The key to recovery from these harmful reactive beahviours is to train the brain to allow you to recognize a) when things are conspiring to freak you out and push your "triggers" and b) to try and stay grounded when IN a trigger so you dont react in a reactive-acting-out-adrenaline-fear-flight-or-fight way.

There are many ways to try and work on "staying present" - hypnotherapy, EMDR, other therapy, meditation, etc. My Therapist has suggested that when feeling triggered to remind myself that I am an adult and I am no longer a kid and although the feelings I am feeling in whatever situation that may be triggering me are the same, that I am NOT the scared, victimzed kid that was so helpless against my abuse. She has suggested that I put "adult reminders" around me to stay grounded - my drivers licence, my business card, play with my engagement ring on my finger.

It really does help!


>>>Not sure how to look at it. In my case I get scared thinking he did it because I was lacking something to make him feel wanted.

Do NOT take it personally. Acting out has absolutely NOTHING To do with you and absoutely EVERYTHING to do with a way to literally survive what happend to him during the abuse and the ensuing emotional crisis afterwards.

>>>Or; he was feeling so low he needed that extra push over the edge cause I didn't bring him up enough. Very confused!!

I know it is hard but try not to over analyze any survivor's acting out/resopnse to trauma. There are often as many response patters in different peopel and in the same person as there are people who have been abused. There is absolutely NO logic or rational way of looking at it - I tried to look at it in my partner for about 3 years and I just had to go "fuck it - his responses are his responses - the make NO sense to me but they have everything to do with the abuse and he is working on it and with help he will get better and my responsibility is to a) stay strong for the times he can't and b) let him know in as a constructive and honest way the things that he continues to do that hurt me and hurt the relationship. Its not possible for me to figure it out because there is no logic to things that are highly illogical and emotional" and had to leave it at that. I couldnt put any cause-and-effect behind any of it or figure it out, even he can't figure it out so why should I try!!!"

Hope this makes sense. If you want to chat further on this let me know. I've been struggling with trying to understand it for a few years now.

It may help to do some reading on certain pschological theories/information particularly:

- trauma/ stress responses (adrenaline triggered responses, "fight or flight" reactions)
- concepts of "learned helplessness"
- post traumatic stress disorder

It is not easy to accept, but it may help you to see that your partner is responding to his abuse, he is acting in a COMPLETELY NORMAL way to a COMPLETLY ABNORMAL experience!!!

P

 

[SAR]

jaywho,

I think I understand it is a way to cause harm to yourself; to degrade yourself to feelings of what you experienced as a child (because you think that is all you are worthy of feeling)

If you understand this then you're ahead of where I was 3 months after I found out about my boyfriend! I'm like you, I fight my fears and uncertainties with information-- for some reason it helps me a great deal to know that whatever I'm scared of, other people talk about it, study it, take it apart. You can do a search in these forums, there's a link on top by the faq. I found 58 matches for "acting out" in the family and friends forum.

the thoughts of continued episodes with my husband is scaring me to death

Have you said anything about this to him? What's done is done, and certainly patience and understanding are a big part of supporting a survivor, but you are his wife and your physical and emotional safety are important here too. You don't have to calmly accept a future of infidelity and insecurity, you can work with him and set new boundaries that are appropriate for your marriage. In some way, just by listening and supporting him this far, by taking away the continuation of the shame and secrecy of his past, you've removed one of the most powerful compulsions to act out again.

My boyfriend and I have talked a lot about how to keep the present and future better than the past. I don't think it's enough just to say "This won't happen again" without a real understanding of why and how it happened, and I don't think that his abuse is the only thing that we need to understand. There were factors in our life and our relationship that made it difficult for both of us during the time that he acted out sexually. We've talked about how to close the door on the entire atmosphere of worry, stress, lack of communication, etc. that surrounded his acting out.

One big part of the way this works for us is keeping our emotions out in the open. Both of us try to say things to each other that previously would have been bottled up--this includes his abuse-related feelings. It's okay for him to tell me, "I had to fight really hard not to look at porn today." Instead of focusing on his shame, and pushing him into guilt and worthlessness (which is what he'd have done to himself if he'd looked at the porn), he can talk it out with me and get at the cause of his desire, and we can both see it as a victory--he's learning how to discuss his feelings and control his behavior, we are able to communicate about difficult things, we can trust each other better and feel secure in the relationship.

Hope this helps,
SAR

 

[PAS]

One big part of the way this works for us is keeping our emotions out in the open. Both of us try to say things to each other that previously would have been bottled up--this includes his abuse-related feelings. It's okay for him to tell me, "I had to fight really hard not to look at porn today." Instead of focusing on his shame, and pushing him into guilt and worthlessness (which is what he'd have done to himself if he'd looked at the porn), he can talk it out with me and get at the cause of his desire, and we can both see it as a victory--he's learning how to discuss his feelings and control his behavior, we are able to communicate about difficult things, we can trust each other better and feel secure in the relationship.

Ok.. existential question here on "acting out":

I know that almost ALL guys on this planet, SA or no SA, who have access to porn look at it or have looked at it from time to to time. And I am fairly sure that almost all guys on this planet have/do masturbate, as many women do as well..

In that sense.. is "acting out" a label that is given to SA survivors for doing the things that many non survivors do?

There are some types of sexual acting out that are pretty obvious - repeated or compulsive sex acts that are not in keeping with one's sexual orientation, chronic cheating, sex addiction, chronic porn/masturbation at the expense of a relationship, etc. But if the survivor is looking at porn/masturbating no more than the "rest of the male population" is this really "acting out"? Are we "stigmatizing" the survivor by calling in them, "acting out" what is fairly normal behaviour by the rest of the population?

I guess this is one thing that I have been trying to discuss with my partner - haha can you imagine a woman telling her partner "dont feel so guilty honey, occasional porn and masturbation is ok".. how ridiculous is that but I have actually said as much to my partner, because I don't believe that looking at porn and masturbation is all that awful or that abnormal (my own insecurities about porn and ethical issues about the porn industry aside of course). And if he started masturbating all the time at the expense of our relationship, or started cheating on me THEN I'd have a problem.... does anyone understand what I am getting at?

I suppose it is all about WHY or what pushed the survivor to look at porn - is it a way to handle the feelings of the SA then I can understand that it is "acting out".. but if its not an abuse-response, then whats the big deal? Just something I've been mulling over....

P

 

[SAR]

PAS,

Are we "stigmatizing" the survivor by calling in them, "acting out" what is fairly normal behaviour by the rest of the population?

This is a really interesting question and one I think about too, maybe you've begun to answer it yourself by saying how you've had to say "Don't feel guilty honey..."

Honestly I'd never given much of a thought to my boyfriend looking at porn one way or the other, I know that there isn't any in our home or on his computer, and I know that he has a hard time about the way that some guys at work all check out dirty pictures together, that's not something he sticks around for but I'd assumed that was his insecurities about masculinity more than a problem with the pornography itself.

The only reason I ever thought of it as an acting out behavior is because he told me how he feels compelled to do it, and afterwards he doesn't feel especially turned on, just ashamed and guilty and abnormal. And even with that, I've never asked him not to look at porn. The "fight" is all about him wanting to stop his own compulsion to do things that make him feel bad about himself. He did act out with another girl online and before I ever found out about it, he ended it with her and stopped chatting entirely, removed all the programs and everything. I don't know how comfortable I'd be with him continuing to chat online... probably I'd have asked him to stop that.

I do think that if someone were to feel that pornography (or drinking, or not recycling, or anything else) was immoral or unacceptable no matter what, then that person is entitled to her feelings and should set relationship boundaries that include those feelings, regardless of her partner's abuse history. But I think that sometimes abuse history becomes an issue here where it doesn't have to be. For example, if I thought pornography was 100% unacceptable, I would say "I think pornography is 100% unacceptable and it makes me uncomfortable when you look at it, I don't want to be with someone who finds porn okay," I would not say "I think you're only looking at that disgusting porn because of your abuse history and I'm uncomfortable being with someone who is acting out like you." I'm being reductive and silly here but I think you know what I mean.

 

[PAS]

Originally posted by SAR:

The only reason I ever thought of it as an acting out behavior is because he told me how he feels compelled to do it, and afterwards he doesn't feel especially turned on, just ashamed and guilty and abnormal.

*stuff snipped*

I do think that if someone were to feel that pornography (or drinking, or not recycling, or anything else) was immoral or unacceptable no matter what, then that person is entitled to her feelings and should set relationship boundaries that include those feelings, regardless of her partner's abuse history.

Re: point #1 - yeah it is the "feeling compelled to do it" indeed is what I think of as the "acting out" part - and in that way sexual acting out is no different than say, taking drugs or drinking to excess.. its a compulsive thing, shaped and influenced by an abuse history and its not good for the survivor.

Re: point #2 - I also agree..

 

[MikeNY]

Moving this back to the top of the message board for a couple of people.

 

[Lloydy]

Thanks Mike, I missed this for some reason, on holiday maybe?

Others say in acting out it was a way they re-lived the past. Why re-live the past ever?

Why indeed? But the past shapes us, we learn just about everything as we grow up, what I learned ( amongst other things ) was a distorted view of sex and power.
And even though I tried my best to make up for lost time when I left boarding school, and got married to a very sexual woman when I was 21, the 'old' ideas surrounding sex remained intact.

Then as the excitement of sex with my wife wore off, as it often does, rather than address that issue I used fantasy. And the easy thing to use was the sex I'd ( apparently ) enjoyed as a boy.
But that came laden with guilt and shame, which I didn't realise at the time.

The guilt / shame made things worse, and sexual failure became more common as I fought against the fantasy. So I'd masturbate instead - to see if the fantasy, and 'me' still worked. Which it usually did.

All that told me was that my fantasy was 'right' - so I pursued the fantasy until I acted it out.
This was a slow process, it took many years to progress from masturbating in privicy to ahving sex with strange men.

Do you know when you are acting out or is it later you realize you did this because of the emotion it causes?

Very good question, and I have to say "yes" and "yes" - but with reservations.
Did I know? yes, at my worst I could plan my acting out weeks in advance.
If I knew that on a particular day I would be somewhere that provided an opportunity I would slip into a planning / fantasy mode. I would avoid sex, well masturbating only by then, and construct incredibly detailed fantasies about what I hoped would happen. This planning would take up ALL of my available time, I would avoid contact with people just so I could hone and perfect the fantasy. At this time I spent most of my time working alone and we live in a very quiet place, so I spent LOTS of time on this.
Did I know it was 'wrong'? yes, but I would tell myself that I would stop just short of actually going through with the sexual acts when the situation arose. I thought that the fantasy stage was enough, but guess what? it wasn't.

Could I stop the process? no, I tried and tried. What I had created had become a monster, and I had no control over it.
That might sound like an excuse, but it isn't.
I can remember this happening very clearly, it was at it's worst only 7 years ago and it's very vivid in my memory.

Which is why I answer 'yes' to only realizing later that the whole acting out thing was more about a 'mental' thing than a 'sexual' thing.
When I did act out with other men I didn't find it at all sexually stimulating, I never got an erection or allowed them to touch me at all. Often I would flee before "we'd" finished the BJ, much to their surprise. I have ended up fighting with other men to get away from something I thought I wanted, something that I had also started with them.
But if the fantasy of the day wasn't being played out then I was off!

So now, with the wonderful benefit of hindsight, therapy and hard work, I can see that I was feeding nothing else other than the distorted fantasy, emotions and memories.
Sex was the least of the problem, at least as far as the question "did I really want sex with other men?" was concerned.
"No" I didn't, what I wanted was to re-write history and re-create the sex I had as a boy to my new script.

Dave