The pull of the sexual past

The pull of the sexual past
D

dwf

Registrant
I've been coming around this the MS site for a couple of months now and it has been a great source of information, support and camaraderie.

I came here at the suggestion of my T and he and I meet every week to work on issues that come up as I wade through the memories and hurt of the past abuse.

I've gotten up enough courage to start to do some things that I haven't been able to face for the last couple of years.

One thing that has really bothered me was the effect that the SA has had on my ability to enter in and sustain intimate relationships.

I've gotten better at the non-sexual intimacy; but the sexual intimacy remains very elusive.

My T told me yesterday (well, he suggested) that those types of relations will be the most difficult for me to handle.

Boy, was he right! I'm actively seeking to date, get to know other guys. I'm trying to be real honest and upfront about what I'm looking for. That's not so hard.

What is harder is for me to stay true to what I've decided my standards of behavior.

Example, I've got a history of a pattern of sexual behavior where I get involved with someone who is completely unavailable.

Sometimes it has been a married man who wants to have sex with another guy but is not able or willing to have any emotional connection.
I go into it saying that I'm just there for the sex, but then I find that is not really all that I want.

I really want sex with some emotional intimacy with someone who is available to be in some sort of on going relationship.

Other times, the guy has been really cruel and/or alcoholic. I've said well, I'll just have sex and then move on. Once again, I like the sex, even though it invariably reminds me of the sexual abuse, but don't walk away. I come back for more and the situation will continue to get worse.

I experience a lot of guilt, anxiety, worry, shame and fear about the ways I have continued to repeat these old 'self-defeating' behavior.

The really good news is that today I can pull the feel of those old patterns of behavior but I don't act on the feelings of wanting to engage in the conduct that hurts me and others so much.

I guess I can only explain this change by the fact that I've been able to reach out and ask for help and have received it, from my therapist and especially here.

There's a guy I've been chatting with who said he was looking for some guy friends to go fishing and other male things with. That sounded good to me, so I answered him and told him my spiel about no married guys, no gratuitous sex, no interest in using each other for sexual gratification alone.

I know that these things aren't a problem for lots of men, but for me they are like a poison.

Well he wrote back and said, well, yeah, I am married but not happy and just sticking around for the kids etc. Same old story.

There was a part of me that sort of went "Hey, he would be a good person to have some recreational, no strings attached sex with."

But another voice from a part me that I've nurtured here and in my therapy said that I didn't want to do that, go down that road. And so I wrote him back. I don't want to interfere with anyone's marriage, especially where there are children involved.

I'm compassionate enough to be able to sympathize with the guy's dilemna and to wish him the best in his struggle.

But I'm also capable of loving myself enough to not get involved in something that I know will cause me hurt and shame.

Isn't that great? Feels pretty good to me. I'm still lonely and horny but I'm not ashamed of myself for violating my own standards of behavior.

OK, got to go now. There's another guy I'm going to call who isn't married, isn't into gratuitous sex and may be someone I can get to know. After that, maybe we might even care enough about each other to consider what it would be like to be sexually intimate.

Wow, the scary thing is that I really do believe that is can happen eventually. Maybe not tonight, or tomorrow, but eventually.

And I don't have to sacrifice my beliefs or my self-respect to make it occur.

It's good to realize some progress in the way I act towards others and myself.

I can feel the pull of the past, but today I don't have to be a victim of it.

I owe a lot of that progress to the support I get here.

So, I say thank you, my brothers,

Gratefully
 
Danny:
Way to go.

I think what you are really looking for is love. That is what life is all about. Having that special person in your life to share your hopes for the future, your passion for life as well as the heartaches that you feel. It is giving to someone without expectation and receiving the same thing back.

Love is a very powerful emotion, no less than the exact opposite Hate. You are resisting the pull of the past and that goes a long way to quelling the selfhate and bringing on the inner peace.

In reality sex for the sake of sex and no feeling of belonging or caring by both sides is just that. SEX and nothing more. To put it bluntly you would get as much emotional satisfaction as using a knothole in a fence. But sharing your mind and your body with someone else is quite remarkable.

Danny some day you will find the right guy. But I suspect he may find you first. Hang with guys that like the things you are interested in. Martial arts is one I think. I think you are athletic so join a biking or hiking club or whatever. The common ground to start with will help.

I am glad you are doing so well, so pat yourself on the back.
 
Danny,

It's great to read about progress. Recognizing the behaviors that led to unhappiness and worse, then short circuiting them stomps out a little bit of the abuse damage each time.

Bad habits can be self perpetuating, but so can good habits. (Clue alert! That's why they're called habits, Joe.)

I hope you have a relaxed and relaxing good time sharing a little bit of your life with this guy, and maybe something more later.

Thanks for posting good news. It's better than coffee in the morning!

Joe
 
Danny, you are really thinking well. Like Mike says, we all want to be loved. You now know that difference between sex and love. So you can have sex if that is all you want. And you can look for a life-giving relationship as well.

You post is encouraging to me.

Bob
 
>

OK, the past is pulling really hard today.

And pulling on a certain part of my anatomy and getting me really screwed up inside.

Geez, all I want to do is maybe date a little, maybe meet someone to get to know a little better, maybe have a little sex...

Why is that so goddamned hard?

It seems a lot easier for me as a gay male to have sex with someone than to get to know them.

Of course the internet chat rooms are just filled with sex for hire guys and that pisses me off.

No wonder I never go there. But it really struck me today. These guys will show their dicks to the world and stick their asses in a webcam but can't be bothered to have a conversation.

I may need to rethink this plan--but how the hell else do you meet people? I hate bars since I quit drinking....

So this morning this guy wants me to come over and watch porno movies with him.....naturally I hesitated. You know a little sexual relief might not hurt me a bit, I thought (that's the past talking there).

But I lied and said no I've got to go to work.
So then he's asking me if I'm a top or a bottom---he's wanting me come over there so he can fuck me in the ass. He's bored and so he wants me to come over and let him fuck me. A complete stranger.

In a way it was good that he was so offensive about the way he approached me. If he'd of been smart like a perpertrator he would have been a little more deceitful about it.
he might have got me hooked in.
Man, I disgust myself just even hesitating for a second to turn somebody like that down.

It actually took about 5 seconds...and then I started to get upset.

I mean, not even a handshake at the door, just bend over?? I declined his invite and am sitting here shaking my head.

I guess at least part of what's bothering me is that there was a time not too long ago when I would have gone.

I would have said, no I better not go. But then I would have gone.

I probably would have said no to the anal sex with a complete stranger. I usually have to be completely drunk for that to happen.
But then maybe I wouldn't have said no.

There have been times when I meant to say no but forgot when things started happening.

I'm just frustrated because I know there's no easy way to do this.

And I know no one else can do it for me.

I'm 49 fucking years old and can't get another human being close to me without settling for cheap, gratuitous sex.

Sometimes that old behavior really looks like a way to get some relief.

But since I'm trying to make sure that it stays "old Behavior", I'll just come here and whine about it all instead.

It's just that I can feel that sort of obsession starting up....I'm afraid that I'll get so frustrated I'll just say what the hell, why not?!

And I know what that feels like afterwards.

That hurts worse than anything to feel used and then thrown away. I just don't work that way.

Evidently a lot of these guys don't mind it, but it's a total mind fuck for me.

I still can't believe this cowboy this morning. he said he was just laying around the house and was bored, so why didn't I come over and let him do his thing.

No wonder I think sex is dirty and hurtful.

It'd be Ok if I still didn't want to try to find a guy to get close to. If I could just completely give up on wanting love or intimacy. How does one do that? Give up on love? I can't seem to manage to do it, no matter how long and how hard I've tried.

I guess that's a good thing. But a lot of times it hurts like hell to want to be loved in an intimate way. And to not get it.

It's like a starving man walking by a nice reataurant. I don't realize how much I miss it until I'm around it.

Maybe I should just become a goddamned fucking prostitute and forget trying to be anything better or different. Goddamn it I am so mad I'm crying.

Son of a bitch. now I'm getting angry that I don't get to have anybody get close to me on account of what the motherfucking son of a bitch who abused me and took that away from me so long ago.

Man this is hard.

I gotta go now, Venting about it here is better than doing something I know I will regret and feel like shit about later.

I guess i don't get to be like those other guys that can just go stick their dicks any old place and walk away. It's got to be a big fucking drama for me. I've got to have some stupid standards.

I'm pretty pissed right now at the man who robbed my fucking sex away from me before i even knew what it was.

O shit
 
Dear Danny,

It's good that you did post here instead of picking up the old behavior where you left it.

That guy's not worthy of your time. That's why he didn't ask for it.

Keep riding your bike, playing tennis, working with the flowers, the horticultural center. You will find someone with a decent personality when you're engaged in healthy activities that interest you. It will happen.

Take pride in your accomplishment today. You squashed a little more life out of the old behavior, loosened its grip on you some more.

I gotta run now. I'll check back in another hour or so.

Your friend,

Joe
 
Danny,

The issues you are talking about do not bother me and are not triggers for me personally, but the subtext, your anger, rage and sadness and despair frighten me terribly. :eek:

Everything that you have been enduring as of late amounts to nothing less than crucifixion, one of the most agonizing deaths. I can relate to your feelings, and I sense the agony that you are going through. I am reminded of the struggles that I have gone through regarding the issues you mention.

Exorcism is dubious affair. If we are lucky, it happens quickly like Saul of the road to Damacus. For most of us, it is a looonnnnnnggggg difficult process, a way of life. As Socrates said: "Life is one long rehearsal for dying". True dat.

Danny, just think: before you found MS, all of these pesky thoughts and emotions were alive and well, but far from the surface, far from your reach. They were living inside of you, making your eyes see, making your lips talk, making your legs carry you places against your will, making your arms reach out to embrace poison willingly.

But now, you have seen them and called their names!!!! They are not happy, brother. They know that their days are numbered. They are fighting a war, tooth and nail, on the landscape of your soul, but THEY ARE NOT WINNING!!!

Your struggle and the ensuing emotions are, with your participation, following a prescribed sequence of events leading you out and into freedom.

Just think, a couple of months ago, you would not have even seen such things as you mention as being detrimental to your emotional, psychological and spiritual health. When that was the case, the monsters were pleased to just live out their lives without any resistance from you. You were still the innocent Danny pre abuse, unknowing that anything was even controlling your very life force. Now, your eyes are opened, and you are starting to say NO! All hell is breaking lose on you now.

All of these things that you are struggling with these days are so similar, the faith issue, the sex issue. They are all about continuing to permit something outside of you to dictate the course of your life. You are saying NO! now, and the risk of having all of your life's familiarity erased looms like shadow at the thought of being left with nothing. After all, the devil you know is much better than the one you have not met.

You do not have to face life alone anymore. Just as you are confronting these demons here as you continue the work of deconstruction, you will surely meet angels as you reconstruct with all of our help, support and, yes, REAL love.

We won't ask you to bend over, spread your cheeks, give us money, and we won't take yours.

Keep on keeping on Danny, and just prove to us and to yourself, that the power of MS to inspire, transform and unite is the greatest power on earth. Our lives depend on it.

Thanks Danny for being brave enough to accept the gauntlet, and for showing us how it's done.

Blessings

Ron
 
Danny
You're todays "hero", you changed your thoughts and actions and did something for yourself.

It's so fucking hard, how long have we been practicing the shite our abusers taught us ?
32 years for me, how the hell can we be expected to overthrow all that in a couple of years ?
We can't Danny, that's the truth. So rejoice in every small victory.

"Yeah - right !" I hear you say. "I could have had sex, some fun. Maybe forgot about all the crap for a while. But instead I'm here with a shitload of crazy emotions."

I would bet serious money that the "crazy emotions" would be twice as bad if you'd gone to that guy.
Some people get away with being promiscuous, good luck to them if it causes them no grief. ( I somehow doubt it though )
But it does cause us grief, promiscuous sex is one degree away from the abuse we endured. My acting out was just the same, I thought I needed that, but that wasn't the case. I needed it like I needed a hole in my head !

Too much guilt and shame there, way too much.
And they're very strong and powerful emotions, much like pride and satisfaction.
And maybe you're feeling "pride and satisfaction" for turning the offer down ?

Maybe also you're not used to equally powerful, but different, emotions ?

We've felt guilt and shame for too long Danny, shove them where the sun don't shine. Up the cowboys .............

Dave ;)
 
Danny,

You're doing the right thing and you are my hero of the day too. It's so empowering to recognize feelings for what they are. You don't have to act on those negative feelings. I know that when I used to spiral down and act out, getting some anonymous sex anywhere I could, I felt horrible afterwards. I felt that I'd failed again and was worthless. Just having sex without love, without compassion, without even a word of conversation is hurtful to my soul. It's just me getting off at the expense of my self worth. It's not an easy road and like Dave said we've had a lot of years developing whatever strategies we had to deal with the abuse (38 years for me)so it's not going to just go away, as much as I wish that it would. For me the struggle is getting less and less. Sure at times I feel the urge to do some old behavior but the urge doesn't last very long if I take the time to examine what I'm really feeling. Right now I'm feeling lonely and abandoned and I've thought about some of the old behaviors that I used to do to mask these feelings and how I felt afterwards. It's not worth the self-loathing for me to engage in that kind of stuff again.

Keep up the struggle my brother, we're all here for each other.

Steve
 
Dear Stephen,

Thank you for your kind words of encouragement and compassion.

You and the rest of the guys here at MS give me the type of understanding I've never found any where else; the type that comes from having walked the same difficult path.

Right now I'm feeling lonely and abandoned
Click to expand...
My heart is sad along with you, my brother. I can be glad that we have found each other here at MaleSurvivor.

And yet I am still terribly grieved by the pain and suffering that brought you and I here.

I'm sorry that you are feeling so lonely. I wish there were a way to make the hurt go away.

I would do anything I could to have that happen.
Know that you have people like me who care and are always available to be a listening ear and friend to lean on.

Thanks again for your words of support, Stephen.

They really help a lot.

Take care and keep in touch. We're here for you.

Your brother,
 
Danny,

I am really proud of you too. I've done the anonymous sex thing, meeting guys in chat rooms and hooking up. It is so empty but has such a pull to it.

I'm glad to hear that you know you are worth more than that. You are! You're one of the guys that inspire me to keep coming back here and struggle. We will make it through to brighter days.

I wish I could be there with you when you are going through the tough times. Can't do that but I can be here.

I'm a cyclist too -- mountain biking. You can liken this struggle to huffn' it up one of those huge hills, takes a lot of work, a little pain, can be slower than hell and you think sometimes "i will never get there." When you do get there the view is spectacular and the trip back is a lot easier.

Thanks for sharing your struggle, it makes it a lot easier for all of us to know we are not alone.

Stephan, I'm there too, feeling alone and kind of out there. A bit lost. I know the pull of those old behaviors. I hear you.

Your brother in the struggle,
Aaron
 
Martin
You are NOT alone...........

Dave ;)
 
If you need to connect pick up the phone, write a letter. Send an email. Plant something pretty.
Take a walk and see the wonderful world around you. I would love to visit TX in the winter when I am covered with snow. That would be a cool thing.

Love is great. Love is a good thing to look for, but do not settle for less. Being with a commited perso is much better than helping some guy to get off.

I have always been confused with love and sex, and wanted love from men but had sex.

It never made me feel all that great. Initailly yes, but it was never what I wanted.

Friend I hope you stear toward healthy relationships.
 
Danny,
Your e-mail could have been written by quite a number of the male survivors I've worked with in my practice. The issues you present are familiar to a lot of survivors. You seems to be making incredable strides in recognizing your old patterns and making new, better choices.
A couple years ago I contributed a chapter to a book titled "Gay Men and Childhood Sexual Trauma: Integrating the Shattered Self" by Haworth Press. The chapter I wrote was called "Illusions of Intimacy". It was about the struggle of gay male survivors to find intimacy and the conflict faced in anonymous sexual situations. The book is full of very informative and insightful articles. All of the articles were also published in the Journal of Gay & Lesbian Social Services, vol.12, numbers 1/2 2000.
Its all about boundaries, and as you seem to understand, choices are about where you place your boundaries and how to assert and protect them.
As you've come to understand, married men are not your best bet for intimacy. They have other things that need to be resolved first. Once they've resolved (ended) their marriage, (ex)married men often have greater clarity about who they really are, having gone down the wrong road. But, they have to have completed there soul searching around how they define themselves first.
I would wish you luck, but luck isn't what it takes. One need self awareness, self-knowledge and a commitment to being their own best friend. You sound like you are well on your way to owning the above.

Regards,
Don
 
Thanks, Don, for the nice comments and also for the reference to your book regarding gay male sexuality.

I'm going to look for it. If you know of the link for the article on-line, and don't mind sending it to me, that would be great.

As for married men, a boyfriend and I were just comparing notes on our dealings with those "married to the woman who doesn't understand, and going to get a divorce someday soon" guys.

His take on married/formerly married men: "They're so NEEDY!". :D

My take on married/formerly married men:
"They're so spoiled!". ;)

I guess the bottom line is really "They're so married!".
:rolleyes:

Thanks for the insight. And no offense to the married/formerly married men reading this. Hey, I still like them a lot!!

Your brother,
 
Danny,
I don't know if the article, journal or exerpts from the book are on line anywhere, but I will see if I can find it.
I do have several copies of my article, which I could mail to you. I know giving out addresses is not a good idea on line. So you could e-mail me through this webpage (I know the means are here somewhere) and if you feel more comfortable to do so, you could send me the mailing address of your therapist is you have one now, or some other more anonymous connection. If the whole idea of mailing addresses is not comfortable, just let me know that. I will still try to find it on line regardless.

Don
 
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