question to partners of survivers about triggers

[dark empathy]

Well last night we had a rather unexpected situation.
My wife and I were talking about books (as we do much of the time), and part of the conversation lead on to women's menstrual problems and fantasy writers. My wife mentioned hearing of women who asked to borrow a tampon in the loo and used the phrase "It's a woman thing"

Then suddenly bang! I'm getting a physical flashback of a very unpleasant incident with a used tampon from school where those same words were used. I went completely still and actually panicked slightly before coming out of it after a minute or so.
Of course, it wasn't my lady's fault at all, just a really bad coincidence. She held me, stroked my back and was extremely contrite even though she didn't need to be since I've told her probably more about my abuse than I have most people (even on a practical level), and most conversations we've had have been very healing., heck they've had to be to deal with my genophobia. She actually said she was particularly sorry since I did outline the incident to her on previous ocasions if not the gory details and she'd forgotten that it was a triggering subject.

I won't say this hasn't happened before, but it doesn't happen often, indeed the last time was probably back in february before we were married.
What I felt however was an overwhelming sense of shame, indeed I cried, since I hate! her having to deal with this. It's bad enough that I! have to deal with it, I can't bare hurting the person I love most in the world. It's not the stupid matcho cave man nonsense of "Me man, me deal with problem on own, ug ug", it's just that I can't bare it when my lady's hurting, and I especially! can't bare the thought of me causing her pain, she's already given me so much. I also know that I am not always the easiest person to live with, particularly around negativity, since I do happen to have a tendency to view the world and situations genuinely rather negatively, a tendency I know my lady isn't a fan of (albeit she says that since my negativity is entirely situational and never personal it's not a problem).
I'm genuinely terrified of causing her pain, especially with issues arround my abuse, indeed I'm really disappointed in myself since I thought I'd dealt with things better than this.

Of course, my lady loves me (why I honestly have no idea, but it is an undeniable fact), and so wants to be there for me as much as she can (again why I don't know, indeed I find this rather astounding), indeed we had a rather commical conversation involving whether she should or should not take her usual sleeping tablet or be awake to be with me, since I categorically refused to wake her if I needed her and she categorically refused to go to sleep until she thought I was okay (in the end she backed down on this though since I did sleep okay anyway it wasn't a problem).

Soa question to partners of survivers. Have you accidently triggered your partner, and if so, how would you want him to deal with it?

Luke.

 

[md4e]

Dear Lukes,
What you did was the most loveing. You shared, you showed her your emotions. The very fact you are vulnerable with her draws you closer. It is really the only way we are close and trusting with someone. I read your words and can't help but wish my husband could process his triggers with me! I trigger him in so many ways...asking a question,speaking too loud,wanting of him and the list can go on. Please try and not to be afraid of hurting her because in fact you are helping her when you share your pain. It answers questions she might have. Leads to a freeing relationship not one with the past in control.
So my thought is.....keep it up.
Thanks debbie

 

[Ceremony]

md4e, your kindness means so much.


Know you're listened too also.

 

[WontGiveUp]

Luke - I think what you did is the exact thing I would want my husband to have done. Where he retreated and treated me like the enemy (triggered or not), you have opened yourself up and showed love in a moment where it was hardest for you. Communication, and understanding on BOTH of your parts is what is so encouraging here.

I am sure I have triggered my husband. But he doesnt tell me. He punishes me by withdrawing but saying he isnt - attempting to gaslight me. My husband views me as his enemy and the root of his problems. That you see your wife as your friend, helpmate and confidant is the most loving, amazing thing you could do. I wish my husband treated me with such kindness and consideration.

 

[HealingHope]

Luke the way you protect your wife is truly beautiful but I feel I want to say she's stronger than you think, that's what I've always said to my so when he's agonised about sharing or as I remember now one occasion, where he berated himself for telling me something's he said to himself he wouldn't.
I think back these days so often and I realise there must of been times I triggered him but he never told me I was. He just took time away. How I'd hope he'd be with me this time if he returns is to be vulnerable with me, honest and stay to see that I've really learnt so much about my own behaviours as well as realised so much about csa and how it's maybe responsible for many of our times apart. We all have something we bring to our relationship baggage too, and by staying we could have learnt from each other to manage each others triggers, because we have them too. Knowing your own stuff as a partner is so important. Luke, you have handled your trigger perfectly in my book, you communicated, stayed and showed your true authentic self. Who could ask for more?

 

[dark empathy]

@Ceremony, I hear you too, indeed I often read your posts here. I do feel a little unable to respond sometimes, and indeed on some occasions like a hippocrit since in fairness things for me are vastly different because of my lady, but your definitely heard too.

@Debby, thanks for this. We actually had! to deal with a lot of issues surrounding triggers and my abuse, just because there wasn't another way to deal with genophobia other than being completely honest about it, indeed how my lady dealt with this was quite astounding and still makes me feel humble.
What bothers me is that it already feels as if she's given me so much, when I have issues like this it feels as if I'm malingering or specifically playing for sympathy, since part of me still feels "what right! have I to expect this from my lady"

I admit this is entirely paradoxical. I do indeed take care of my lady on many occasions and feel honoured to do so, whether it's helping her deal with her own baggage or just bringing her tea in the morning, however when it is around my abuse I just feel unworthy in this case given that she's already changed so much in my life.

@Won't give up, it's not even a question of "seeing" I think. My lady is my best friend, there just isn't a way to deny that without being irrational (though I don't think we'd ever use the term "helpmate" given that that seems a little too old fashioned and unequal). The problem i do feel is as I said that I worry about giving her too much to deal with or leaning on her too much. This is entirely irrational of course as I said, and certainly not something which goes the other way, but when you've dealt with something on your own for such a long time it's difficult not to understand that someone else wants! to help out of love. Heck, we have this self same problem around the house, since I'll just do things such as the washing up because I'm used to taking care of them myself, and my lady has to remind me or offer to do things sometimes for me to remember that it's not unfare of her to do so, and manifestly coping with abuse is a lot more major than doing the washing up.

@Healing hope thanks for that. You are certainly correct about my lady, indeed it's something I've said myself that for a very gentle, sensative person she is far stronger than she appears, heck, I just need to remember that she left an emotionally abusive jekkyll and hyde husband and two less than good relationships to be with me, it's just as I said difficult to remember when I've coped with something for such a long time. We have always promised each other to be honest, it's one of the first promises we made last year when we agreed to be together, so there wasn't any possibility of me trying to pretend it didn't happen, however your right I'm probably not giving her enough credit.


Luke.

 

[WontGiveUp]

@Luke - When I said helpmate - I was thinking about emotional help mate! :-D But hey - doing things around the house to keep your place clean, happy and cheerful is a great thing as well. Not only does it show your love for eachother but also a deep respect for one another too.

I feel like I am my husband's best friend. He says I am, but I dont know if he really thinks deeply about it. If he does - he doesnt tell me so. But truly - I really try to act from a place of love in everything I do when it comes to him, even though sometimes I am not successful. I dont know anyone else who holds him in that high regard. I do know he is NOT my best friend, right now he has so many deep issues with himself he cant really truly be anyone's best friend. However, with time - I think as he overcomes his obstacles, he will be the truest friend anyone could ever have. Once he finds a way to respect and care for himself - he can then share those things with the people around him, hopefully including me.

As for worrying about her... I can understand the reason why you would feel that way. Even myself - who have never experienced CSA like you have worry that I cause worry to others so I tend to clam up about stuff. I suspect your wife is a hell of alot stronger than you realize. From what you have shared before - she has also faced her own set of issues (not the same as yours) and has overcome to become a phenomenal singer and successful person. Everything you say about her radiates loving care and extraordinary intelligence. I bet you money she is as solid as they come. And she is right, coping with the abuse is running a marathon. I am sure her priorities are not the washing up versus that. Its good to manage your own washing and your own contribution to the home - its rewarding and its an accomplishment, but listen to your wife when she tells you its the least of her concern when she says it.

You two really sound like an amazing pair. I am so happy to have met you, even though meeting you through here sucks. I guess our lives make us who we are, and we have to make the best of what we have. Seeing you DO that inspires me in 1000 different ways. Seeing how others here do that helps me in my own struggles.

WGU~

 

[dark empathy]

@Won't giveup, Appologies for my response to the word "helpmate" the reason is that the last time someone used it of my wife was the priest who insisted on "mariage councilling" aka giving us a lot of right wing antideluvian rubbish about The woman being the queen of the home", and "the man being the hunter" and how "Only walking in the strict rules of god was what stopped him personally hitting his wife", it was frankly a deeply uncomfortable experience since it felt actively wrong both in terms of christianity and in terms the way my lady and I are together. I do realize though you meant the term in it's literal, rather than biblical or loaded sense, i.e, a mate who helps.

As regards "amazing" well thanks for that, though I am not sure myself, since at the moment things are a little difficult as I've less than a month to finish the corrections for my doctoral thesis, a doctorate most of which was written at extremely grim points during the past few years which actively sets me back into bad patterns, particularly since I have no idea what either my wife, or I will be doing afterwards (right now I just want that part of my life finished with). I do also have a tendency to view the world negatively, though then again i also have a tendency towards self castigation so it's tempting to list my own faults, this again is why the fact that my lady loves me is so completely amazing.

In terms of "best friend" a lot of that for us came through intimacy and basic communication. We exchanged a lot through email even before we met in person, and for a good few months I was still convinced that my lady would be staying with her then current partner and we'd only ever be extremely close friends. It was actually at that point that I told my lady that I'd survived sa, just because the level of our conversations had touched upon so many issues which I simply wasn't equipped to handle, ---- for example it is difficult to respond when someone says "You know when your in a relationship and living with someone", and the honest answer was at that point i really didn't, but we were too close for me to try any sort of evasion.

This was why during the wedding we specifically chose vows which actually said we were friends first.
We also stay! friends, we do a lot together, have many interests in common, music, books, we even perform together on stage extremely well (well when someone gives us the opportunities to do so), so "best friend" just seems natural here, which is again however why I'm afraid of harming her with my abuse or my reactions.

Luke.

 

[KMCINVA]

Luke

I admire your kindness and reaction to protect her. I also admire your wife for being so concerned for you, wanting to be there for you and to help you through the bad moments and your concern that she gets her rest. A match made in heaven I would guess.

I am envious I did not have such a marriage--rather one if I did wake with a nightmare I would be mocked the next morning for the noises I made-never asking what it was about nor did I share for fear of more mocking or a response I projected would be made--get over it--I will never know because it was not until I totally unraveled did I tell and the aftermath proved my hunches to be correct.

You wife wants to be part of your life, she wants to comfort you. My thoughts are let her in, she is there for you. You are so correct she is your best friend--and friends share, friends love and friends are there when you need them.

Kevin

 

[dark empathy]

Hi Kevin, I'm sorry your wife never shared such things with you.

Your correct here, in terms of things, indeed I had a nightmare last night which combined all sorts of nasty stuff and finished up with my lady just being with me, holding in silence all morning. It was actually quite astounding since it was the sort of thing that would! have knocked me out for a day or so previously, still sometimes I do worry about her that she gives a little too much, particularly since in the past people have taken advantage of her for this.

Luke.
Luke.

 

[Ceremony]

Luke, my share is hope. Hope that her empathy, and your empathy, shared with love couples you two in a way that I see endurance and acceptance.

Dear, wonderful, lovely (crying....tears in the way)


acceptance.

 

[dark empathy]

Thanks Ceremony.

Your certainly spot on with empathy, I do just worry for her and myself. She really doesn't deserve me, yet her response when I tell her this is "No I don't, ---- but not in the way you mean" before informing me about the apparently wonderful man she's married to who is I confess, still something of a stranger to me.

Oh well, the fact that we've even got together at all is evidence for miracles, I just sometimes am horrified of waisting this.


Luke.

 

[WontGiveUp]

Luke - she means it, and she believes it, and with good reason. I agree 1000000000% with Kevin, she WANTS to love you, she sees you for who you really are. I suspect you view yourself through a warped mirror. My husband does the same.

Its why he is leaving me, and breaking my heart into so many pieces it will look like the roadmap of Boston if it ever heals.

I know its probably scary for you to be vulnerable, to just breath and let her love you and TRUST her that she means it when she says she is strong enough. Rest in the peace that she is your equal, she is your peer, she IS your help mate. Just as you have that gentle kindness and need to protect her, I bet you anything she feels the same way. Let her. Your lady sounds like one amazing woman, I believe you about her. And that makes me think she is ready and WANTS to be your rock. Let go of the fear that she cannot handle this. She already is.

 

[dark empathy]

Thanks Wgu. I freely admit I do have a problem with perceiving myself as worthless, though for me the problem isn't so much my fear of loving someone else, ---- I've been conscious I could! love someone for years, so much as the fear of hurting someone else.

I lived with genophobia most of my adult life, and was convinced I couldn't even touch a woman without being an abuser, it made me feel as though my fingers were blades, that I couldn't even give someone a hug without being disgusting, something not really helped by so much social pressure about how evil men are. I always had a lot of female friends, (probably %70 of my friends are female), but i always believed that they! were nice people who could tolerate me, rather than that there was anything intrinsic in me that made my friends want! to spend time with me, a viewpoint that was only vindicated when I saw all the people I knew from university go and get married, have offspring etc and my life was just stuck. I didn't lack for evidence of my own general worthlessness, after all I'd been abused, insulted, ridiculed when i was a teenager, that was my closest, most intimate experience, but nobody had ever even wanted to kiss me, let alone have any sort of relationship, indeed when I recieved complements from others they always felt hollow since they didn't change the hole that seemed to be inside me.

This all started to change in July of 2015, when my lady first told me she loved me, heck even though at that point neither of us thought we could be together the fact that someone could! feel that way about me was genuinely astonishing.

this really does feel like being struck by lightning, like walking on the moon. I know! my lady loves me, there's nothing else to be said, it's a solid fact. The problem is the thing that scares me most in the world is hurting her, probably a residue from all that genophobia.

I don't know if your husband thought the same thing in terms of leaving, but believing yourself capable of perpetuating the greatest harm you've experienced is really horrific, though i did find an out, or at least something which convinced me I wasn't actually capable of abuse.
Still I do worry about my lady, especially since she does have a tendency to simply put up with things, though I've asked her to promise me to always be honest especially with things she's not happy with with me, a promise I've kept as well.

Luke.

 

[WontGiveUp]

Luke - I have thought about your last post for a very long time. And I do think there might be something to that, his desire to not hurt me. But honestly I think the reason he is really leaving is that he doesnt want to feel the responsibility of being in a relationship. He has such issues with control, and I truly think that he feels that he has to prove to himself that he can survive on his own with out help. While he may not aknowledge what people have said about him - I think it does deeply affect him. It doesnt matter if I believe it or not (about him using or not using me for a lifestyle). He has to prove to himself and everyone else that he isnt. If he can live in his own space, pay his own bills, not ask for him - then he can live in a place of confidence in himself that he really CAN function on his own, with out help from me, or his mother or his friends. Being dependent on others is an esteem killer, and I think he is starting to realize how negatively some of the choices he made in the past, causing him to have to rely on others, have affected him.

Its hard to see and it is harder to understand - I have always been extremely self reliant. When I didnt handle things, there wasnt anyone I could turn to for help. So I suffered many times because of my own lapses in judgement. Sleeping in a stairwell, alone and scared when its VERY cold and sleeting after watching families living happily in well lit homes through the windows does something to a person. Lights a fire in your soul. I swore I would never be in that position again, and I have worked hard to prevent it. I have chosen to sacrifice some "fun" and habits to ensure that my bills were paid. I never had the latest gadgets or computers... in fact, it wasnt until I was 10 years into my IT career that I purchased my own computer. (and I still have it, and use it even after 10 years of hard use LOL).

My husband never had that moment. He has always gone place to place, depending on others to get him out of a bind, or to loan him money for the bills or to give him 20 bucks to eat on until his pay check etc. And while he LIVED alone, he wasnt self reliant. And I think he needs to believe he can do it. The only way you can truly have faith that you can do something is to actually just DO the thing.

I dont know how much my husband worries about me. I believe he loves me as much as he is capable. I do not believe he has ever set out to use me for a lifestyle, but I do think that he has manipulated me to get what he wants on occasion. I theorize that has more to do with how he learned to survive than malicious intent (like a sociopath would do).

My husband has stated the reason he is leaving me is because he feels like the part of him that desired a romantic relationship is dead. I believe 100% he feels this way, but I also believe 100% that this is a phase of recovery (as all the books say, as our therapist has said, and as many survivors who have worked through recovery have stated here). I also 100% believe that romance and sex in a relationship, while nice and an important part of a healthy relationship, its not THE most important part. I feel like the #1 NUMBER ONE part of a relationship is a true friendship. Because when the looks fade, and the sex dwindles, you need to be able to have a conversataion with your mate. You need to be able to have fun with your mate. And how can you do that if you don't have the foundation of a friendship?

I know in my relationship with my husband, we have MANY years of friendship as a foundation. I have more fun with him and laugh harder with him than anyone else. And as much as I would love to have a healthy romantic relationship with him - that friendship to me is FAR more important. I guess you can say in my own way, I am protective of him in this phase, I would rather choose to not focus on anything romantic or sexual until he is ready - even if it took a few years. That is how important the friendship side of things is to me.

Anyway - I rambled a bit here! I tend to just follow the path where my mind goes when I topic comes up.

I think that even if you had to pull back some, your wife would understand as long as you were open with her. But I would encourage you to not let yourself get overly stressed about hurting her. Its good you are paying attention to your actions and words to prevent it - but dont let that fear paralyze you and hold you back from loving her.

I would give anything if my husband could just accept and have faith in me that I am being truthful with him. He assumes he knows what I want - even when I tell him different. As hard as it might be to believe - believe your wife when she tells you that she is able to cope and handle things. Its a wonderful gift of acceptance and faith.

If only my husband had the faith and trust in me as you do with her... I feel like we could have accomplished anything and everything.

 

[HealingHope]

Wgu what a heart felt post. So much love to you X

 

[dark empathy]

@Wgu, that's quite a story and I really don't know how to respond since matters for me have always been almost the opposite way around, as for me I have been alone mostly as an adult, enjoy being independent (particularly since my parents do tend to be a little on the over protective side), but at the same time have been desperate for a relationship with someone else, very much in terms of love, commitment and intimacy. I've just been categorically unable to believe anyone would be interested in wanting a relationship with me, and because of all the cultural crap about men having to do the asking and perceive sygnals and my utter inability to do that, no way of actually trying to find someone, ---- I've never understood the verb "dating", as in "I'm going to try dating", or "I haven't dated in years"

Indeed according to Sternberg's triangular theory of love I was pretty weerd since the "passion" component of the triangle was something I just didn't follow or understand. Btw, see this wikipedia article

I will say that one thing i've always known is that there was a clear difference between "friendship" and "love", albeit they can exist together. I once for example told my best male friend that were I gay, or one of us female I'd probably be in love with him, he actually agreed, but it was fairly clear we weren't in love. Neither however did this have anything to do with s/x, indeed I considered at various points trying to find a prostitute to deal with my genophobia, but whenever i played through the scenario in my mind I could never imagine it working, indeed I frequently had nightmares of having intercourse with a cold, indifferent or brisque partner. Yet all that being said, lovemaking is only a small part of the ways in which my wife and I communicate, indeed only a small part in the ways we physically touch each other, ---- heck we spend more time just talking about books .

One thing I will say which did rather strike me forceably, was the fear of harm caused by responsability. Before my lady and I got together but after we'd admitted we loved each other, I told her she was better off with the man she was with (I didn't know at the time he was a selfish, semi abusive scuzbag), because I simply didn't have enough of a life for her to be part of.

Needless to say she denied this and pointed out that we could make a life together, but I'll say that it's still a fairly major issue that worries me on iccasuib, particularly since once I finish my doctorate I genuinely don't know! what I'm going to be doing with my life.

I'm not saying this is the case, obviously everyone's different, it's just some of my perspective on the matter.


Luke.