not worth reading -- i jut needed to type

not worth reading -- i jut needed to type
Harry

Harry

Registrant
Hey guys. Just feelin' like shit again. Thought I'd make a post about it cause I know you guys are always listening.
I was having a great couple of weeks. That girl I posted about before that I was worried about what to do with -- I told her everything. I have been as honest with her as I have been with all of you here. She was sooooooo supportive. She understood that I wasn't comfortable at all with sex and my whole damn sexuality, and is still in love with me. She doesn't make any advances on me that might make me nervous. She treats me like a best friend that she loves a lot. It's more than I could have asked for. But I still feel a lot of stress because I still feel kind of straight. Maybe I am still just deluding myself but I want to go all the way with her because a) I love her so much, and b) because of the pressure of being a 20 year old virgin that wants to experience sex.
Anyways, I've been having a great first 3 weeks of Junior year of college. Been stoned most of the time (sometimes drunk) (both right now). And tonight was great but then I kind of ruined it for myself. Let me explain how easily I fucked up a incerdible night for myself:... I was having such a great time, that waited for something slightly depressing to come up, and I dwelled on it and obsessed about the feeling of sadness, and let myself be completely engulfed by it for the rest of the night. It's like I wouldn't let myself have a good time. I didn't deserve to. I also think it was like I was having such a good time, and I wasn't used to it. I was scared of it and made myself go back to feeling depressed because that's what i knew so well. I cant understand why I was having the best night of my life with people that I truly love, and yet now I am getting suicidal (don't worry - not gonna do it). I just feel like I've cut myself off from life for so long that now when I am enjoying it fully, that I find life is just too much for me. I can't survive happiness this pure.

Don't worry about me. I'm in the process of getting therapy. Waiting to hear back from a psychologist on campus about finding referals for off campus counseling (she's also looking for someone with male SA victim/survivor(?) experience).

Wow, I feel like sh*t. Part of me needs a hug and part of me is scared to hell of getting one.

-John
I love you guys.
 
John,
Thanks so much for sharing. Everything we have to say is worth saying. I appreciate your sharing vey much. I relate to the inability to accept and be comfortable with the good God offers us. Suicide for me is my ultimate option a lot of the time also. I feel I want to give up the battle against myself sometimes. I am worn out with fighting myself. But, thank God there is a spark of Mikey that says....just maybe this too shall pass. So wonderful you are seeking healing at a young age! The therapist I feel will be a great resource for you. Mine has changed and saved my life. I am quite up and down these days but still things are better than I ever dreamed amidst the insanity I sometimes have.
Glad you are here and look forward to your posts.

MichaelW
 
JOHN..........just read your post and it is almost like we are living in paralell universes.......i too had been feeling ok the past few days, then last night i just fell apart......i started crying sitting on my bedroom floor.....i could not stop for like 2 hours....the hurt, pain was just so intense.....i did not see it coming, i just became so sad!!!!!!!!!!!! i've read your previous posts and responded to them.....remember there is nothing wrong with being a 20-year-old virgin....of course, this is coming from a 42-year-old "virgin".......i think you will have sex when you are ready.....of course, that is what i've told myself for 25 years.......it is great that you are seeking therapy.....i began therapy back in january....i guess it is helping.....just realize it is not a quick and easy fix for the things that have happened to you.....there will be dark times before you feel better.....i just want you to be prepared for them.....it is not easy, but my therapist says it will eventually make me feel better about myself and diminish my suicidal ideation......i guess i have to trust him, what other choice do i have.....JUST REMEMBER HOW COURAGEOUS YOU ARE TO FACE THIS PROBLEM NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!! to tell your girlfriend about it.......do you know how many girls i just bailed on, never telling them anything.....we'd get too close and i'd panic, i'd blame them for not caring about me, not being pretty enough, being insensitive....anything not to face the real problem>>>>> ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! do you realize how much i admire your strength???????? face your situation now, do not run and hide from the world like i've done for my whole life.....take care of yourself......if you need anything, i'm here.......michael
 
Guys,

This is hard stuff and we all need to take it one day at a time and to not expect recovery to be instant or neat and tidy. We have years of I'm-not-worthy messages that we have taken from others...and even given to ourselves. Consequently, it doesn't follow that we wouldn't shoot ourselves in the foot sometimes even when things are going well. But there is always a next time...

Harry, you are so fortunate to have found a woman who loves you and wants to spend time with you. Be gentle with yourself, man. Actually, after a couple of days have gone by, it might even be worth talking with her about the very stuff that you included in your post. It's not up to her to fix it, of course, but since you've been forthcoming from the get-go, you might just be amazed at her ability to her about your ups and downs.... At the very least, she'll discover that it isn't anything that she did.

It's wonderful that we have this forum to process the "stuff" that continues to haunt us.... Out of our collective sharing comes acceptance and understanding.

You are to be congratulated for knowing about some of your demons, for confronting them and seeking help, and for your willingness to be open with us about your process. You're going to make it, my friend.....

Be well,

Dynamite Don
 
John,

So let me see if i got this right, tonight was going great and then you got full of great and you decided to have a different experience, something that your more used to, a more comfortable place, hmmm, makes good sense to me, i do that myself.

I am glad your having a good time at school and that your letting yourself experience some of the good stuff, just cruise with it, ok, its not going to hurt you and when your full, you can always retreat a little bit back to the more comfortable place that you kow so well. Dude, i think your doing great!

You look like i need a hug,, [john] hugs john,, ahhhh much better, hehe

Take care John,

John
 
John, I know from whence you speak. I am happy that you found a girl who can actually respect your boundaries. In the weeks before my abuse was revealed to me, I was going out with a girl who I told I wasn't interested in sex. She claimed that she wouldn't put any undue pressure on me.

I didn't know WHY I wasn't willing to get as physical with her as she wanted, but I was honest with her.

And then she started getting weird with me BECAUSE I wasn't responding. She called me up one night, started describing a fantasy on the phone. It really freaked me out. She wasn't respecting the boundaries I had set. I think that she thought I was just trying to play coy, or something, and all she needed to do was "warm me up properly" or something.

It was investigating these strange feelings I had that helped contribute to my eventual breatkthrough. Since I didn't trust her enough to tell about my abuse, after a week of not calling her, I finally sent her email saying that I had personal stuff to deal with, and that I wasn't in a place to date anyone. I kept it vague. I haven't missed her.

Originally posted by SoCalJohn:
John,

You look like i need a hug
Click to expand...

That, my friend, is genius. You guys ALL look like I need a hug!



{{{every NOMSV member}}}

Jeremy
We're in this together.
 
Harry -- good for you for being honest with your girlfriend, and I am really happy for both of you that she is supportive. What a wonderful gift to you both!

I agree with everynone else who has told you how courageous and strong you are in sharing, getting help, etc. Good for you!!!

I have one concern and perhaps an insight. One reason you may have felt more dperessed is that you were "high" on alchohol and marijuana, if i understood you correctly. These are both depressants, not stimulants, as many people mistakenly believe. They also reduce your abililty to function, etc.

I wonder if you use alchohol and other stuff to escape and medicate yourself? I know that I sure did when I was in college. If this is what you are doing, I feel concerned for you and a bit scared. I am afraid that you may become addicted, if you are not already, and that only makes things worse, both for your ability to function in school and your ability to recover form your abuse.

As painful as giving up these escapes can be, it always seems to be the best thing to do. Only then will you truly be able look at yourself and your needs and your feelings and begin to really address them. Of course, you can only do so when you are ready to do so. Something to think about.

I am really glad you are seeking counseling and wish you good luck in your recovery process. I am really happy that you are here and sharing...keep coming back!

Thanks again,
LanceC
 
By the way, Harry -- your insight about resorting to obsessing and feeling depressed is probably a very good one. I know that I used to do the same thing, and it is a very common response for survivors to do this. Good work in seeing it yourself!

LanceC
 
hey again.
things are going well.
everythings happy and good.
too good. :(
not used to it.
i make myself go bad to bad when its too good.
i am excited because it is going to get better too.
i am going to berkeley to the girls home next weekend.
love her so much
so happy when i'm with her.
cant wait til next week.
not ready though.
too much happiness.
i have a feeling that i will definately ruin it
like i will crack or something
shit
how do i let myself enjoy what i rightly should enjoy?
damn.
i need more support i guess. uhm. still working on getting therapist. its getting done. but it wont be done by this weekend. uhm, hope everyone's great.


don't crack john.
don't crack john.
don't crack john.
don't crack.
don't crack.
don't crack.
don't.
don't.
don't.
.
.
.

[ September 23, 2001: Message edited by: Harry ]
 
John, it's so good to hear from you. It's scary to let the walls come down.

You've let someone into your hardest shell, and now you are vulnerable to any injury.

But do you really have to fear injury? Really?

The other scary part of letting those walls come down, is that you are now free to come OUT into the world! You don't have to hide anymore!

Since 9/11, we've learned that freedom is a double-edged sword. But the risk of injury (many of which can be prevented, and the worst of which would reach us regardless of the walls) is worth the price of living free, in my estimation.

Plato wrote (through the voice of Socrates), "The life which is unexamined is not worth living." -Dialogues, Apology, 38.

That quote got me looking at my copy of Bartlett's Familiar Quotations. It is a reference book for who said what, throughout history.

I just came across Socrates, who is one of my heroes. He's only got 8 of them listed, but that is because most of what we know about Socrates was actually recorded by Plato. It is unclear whether Plato wrote down the dialogues verbatim, or simply used the "character" of Socrates as a sounding board for his own ideas.

Anyway, from the mouth of Socrates, himself:
"Often when looking at a mass of things for sale, he would say to himself, "How many things I have no need of!" -from Diogenes Laertius, Lives of Eminent Philosophers, bk. II, sec. 25
"Having the fewest wants, I am nearest to the gods." -Ibid. 27
"There is only one good, knowledge, and one evil, ignorance." -Ibid. 31
"My divine sign indicates the future to me." -Ibid. 32
"I know nothing except the fact of my ignorance." -Ibid.
"Bad men live that they may eat and drink, whereas good men eat and drink that they may live." -from Plutarch, How a Young Man Ought to Hear Poems, 4
"I am not an Athenian or a Greek, but a citizen of the world." -from Plutarch, Of Banishment
"Crito, I owe a cock to Asclipius; will you remember to pay the debt?" -from Plato, Phaedo (Socrates' last words)

I don't know what these quotes had to do with your current point, John, but this is the station my train of thought pulled into...

We're in this together.

Jeremy
 
thanks jeremy.
yeah you are right i have to let my wall come crashing down. Have you seen Pink Floyd's "The Wall"? wow. really amazing movie.

i thought about what you said. i'm not really afraid of falling. everyone falls. i'm just araid of breaking my legs when i do. i'm afraid i won't get back up.
 
Jeremy,

Thanks for the quotes...even though I was having a hard time making all the connections (hehe).

I just love your remark at the end of your post:
but this is the station my train of
thought pulled into...
Click to expand...

Clever boy...I love it!

Don
 
Hi John,

I just wanted to say that I was thinking about you. I went on a retreat this weekend and found myself in a beautiful little chapel this morning. I said a prayer for you and all of my friends here at NOMSV.

God Bless,

Brian
 
Don, not all the quotes connected to our current situation (though a few of them are spot-on). I just realized that when I started listing them, that I should list them all.

So if you find the connections, you're a more astute observer than I.

Hey John, it's been a long time since I last saw Pink Floyd's "The Wall." You're right, it's a great film! Strangely, it's all the David Gilmour songs that I like the best, even though the majority of it is Roger Waters' baby. There are plenty of lessons to be learned from the film.

Your comments about falling remind me of what one of my Scoutmasters said, as I commented (while looking over the edge of a cliff we had backpacked to) that I was afraid of falling over it.

"Falling's not bad" "It isn't?" I asked incredulously.
"No, it's the landing you've got to worry about."

So now the question you have to ask yourself is, why do you fear not being able to get back up. Every one of us here has had our times when we've broken down, and felt like we can't go on.

But we're here, working through the most painful things in our psyche. What sane person WILLFULLY puts themselves through this shit??? The kind that wants to heal.

John, you've already shown amazing strength, merely by choosing to face this, and by dealing with it. Don't deny that strength! Whether or not you're used to seeing it, it is there. And it has helped you survive.

We're in this together.

Jeremy
 
hey again. jeremy - i really like when you said (even though it was a week and a half ago) :

But we're here, working through the most painful things in our psyche. What sane person WILLFULLY puts themselves through this shit??? The kind that wants to heal.

-- makes more sense now than it did the first ime i read it. i know i want to heal. speaking of which, here's a little update... I saw a referal doctor on campus and he gave me 3 numbers of doctors. he said nothing about them having experience in male SA, but i didnt bring it up (that was something i only mentioned to the other lady i saw on campus before a few weeks ago). anyways, i figure i can ask the therapists themselves and maybe if they dont have experience, then ask them if they know someone who does. so anyway, today i called all 3 numbers, left messages. 2 called back. i have 2 appointments now within the week. one friday with a guy and one in a wednesday with a woman. i guess it's like another "intake" session or whatever where i just get to get a feel for the person. I'm a little nervous but I'm moving forward slowly.
Marie (the girl I've been talkin about) is still being a great help to me. She said something the other day that made me feel great. she said she wanted to marry me and have my babies. and she meant it. i'd be the happiest guy ever if that happens someday. and it might, just not now. we both understand that we are not ready to have a sexual relationship because of what i'm going through. she's stopped torturing herself about it (even though she still is attracted to me in that way), but i have just begun to torture myself about it. actually the whole thing about getting married and having babies calmed me down. she is wearily still playing the field (i try not to get very jealous - she gets jealous when i talk to other girls too). i don't mind if she does anythign though because she said tonight that whenever i am ready, sometime in the furture, she still will want to marry me and have my kids. damn that felt good to hear.
me and her (and 2 of her friends from UCLA - great people - i just met em but i love em) went to berkeley where Marie's home is this past weekend. Best time of my life. I wanna move there. We were in the "How Berkeley Can You Be" parade. we were dressed in lab coats and called ourselves the Young Republicans for Heterosexuals. It was all a big sarcastic joke thing because everyone up there is so left-wing and all. We were handing out fake pills to people that supposedly made pregnant women's soon-to-be babies turn out 100% heterosexual. Some people booed us but everyone knew we were just mocking other people who thought like that so it was all in good fun. The best was handing out the pills to lesbian couples, heh heh. We were right behind the all gay cheerleading squad too in the parade. most of them got a kick out of it too.
wow - long post huh?

oh yeah and Brian - i wanted to tell you thanks for your prayers. I can't tell you how much it means to me. One of my teachers asked us all last night at class if we had any heroes. I was the only one that raised my hand. I was thinking of you. Course I wouldn't have said why and no one knew who you were so i didnt even mention you when he asked me who my hero was, but just thought you should know that you came to mind first. Aparrently the guy wanted someone famous or something. I then thought of Carlos Santana. Just cause he went through all this male SA stuff too and he made it public and stuff (i read in the NOMSV newsletter on time). Plus he is a damn damn good musician. I have a lot of respect for him too.

holy shit this is gonan be a long post. ok well, take care everyone. I'll keep in touch. I love you guys,

-John
:)


ps - socaljohn--looking forward to meeting you whenever we can meet.
 
Originally posted by Harry:
i know i want to heal. speaking of which, here's a little update... I'm a little nervous but I'm moving forward slowly.
Click to expand...

Good for you, John! I'm glad that you're able to make progress. Best of luck to you in your therapy. I wish you all the strength you'll need as you face down the demons of your past.


Marie (the girl I've been talkin about) is still being a great help to me
Click to expand...

That is awesome that you've found someone that you trust, that you feel comfortable spending the rest of your lives together (when you're both ready for it). She sounds like an amazing young woman! Best of luck to the 2 of you.

holy shit this is gonan be a long post.
Click to expand...

Welcome to my world, John...

ok well, take care everyone. I'll keep in touch. I love you guys,

-John
:)
Click to expand...


It was really good to hear from you! Thanks for sending us an update on how great things are going right now. I can't help but notice the irony of these develpments being contained in a topic entitled "not worth reading." I hope that your story can help provide hope for others who find themselves in the dark places you've been.

I guess I should get on the phone now, and make my own appointment with my therapist. I've finally had a schedule change at work that will allow me to start the counseling, but it's been a bunch of phone tag so far.

Take care John, and everyone else too!

We're in this together.

Jeremy
 
Hi, my name's John and I'm drunk.
Now that i've introduced myself, i think you should know that I don't believe I am self-medicating myself by drinking. I am a college student. college kids drink. and if i do self-medicate myself, its not with alcohol. it'd be with caffeine. i've been taking caffeine filled pills every day because i feel better when i am awake. otherwise i am tired and that makes it easier for me to be a slacker, which i acnnot be because i have so much work to do. I'd rather live in a hospital and have everyone do everythign for me. well, maybe not. I was in a psychiatric hospital for a week when iw as a senior in high school and it was kinda fun and interesting, but i wouldnt go back to the kids hospital. i'd go to the adult one (cause i'm 20 now). then i think of the movie "One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest" and i don't want to go somewhere like that. So i dont know if iw ant to go to a hospital anymore.

hmm, i thought i had a point to writing a post, but now that i think about it, i might not. i just wantyed to talk with you guys. it makes me feel comfortable and more at peace i guess. i dunno. i was full of rage earlier tonight, but it wore off after a lot of beer and i got tired. hmmm, i really want to just go to the conference this month in NY and live there and hang out with people that I can relate to. I won't be going. Don't have $ or an excuse for parents and whatnot. but i just want to belong somewhere. luckily i start therapy monday - well i have an intake anyways. and another one on wednesday. damn i need therapy.

i cut myself a couple nights ago. i'm not into self-mutilation, but i've tried it a coupel times. i hadnt doen it in like a year, but a few nights ago i did it again just cause.... i dont remember why. iw as thinking about doing it agian tonight. i'm too tired though. i was so angry for no reason earlier tonight that i needed to do somethign to get it out of me. but then again, repression is my speciality in life. I'm sure it is a lot of your guy's speciality too. too bad we aren't normal, huh? no wait, i dont wanna bring you guys down. you guys are normal. you just got shitty luck. i, ont he other hand, am the epitimy of the shit of the world.
now i know you guys are all gonna tell me i am not, so i take back what i said. i just feel FUBAR (fucked up beyond all repair - or somethign like that). if there is a chance of repair, i hope it happens soon, cause i dont wanna suffer anymore. i know none of you guys does. i wish i had nothing holding me back from suicide -- but i have lots (family/friends ect.) god what a fucked up life we have to live. its not our fault - we got dealt a shitty hand, but god... why us? are we stronger than other people? is that why we were given these pieces of shit lives? even when i am in a good mood i have too much shit that i am behind in that makes it impossible to enjoy my good mood. too mch shit. i wish i wasn tin school. then i might be able to fight this deression more. then again, its not school's fault. it's my mind's. It's all in my mind. It's all in my mind. It's all in my mind.
damn.......
i just need someone to tell me what to do, and to make sure i do it. cause i probably cant do anythign that will help me on my own. I dont think i am capable of helping myself. i need therapy, but i cant make myself think that therapy will solve all my problems. cause it wont, right? it hasnt for you guys anyways. sure, it'll help. but will i need more help than that? is enough help available? if it is, will i be strong enough to go get it?

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NOPE!

-john

-ps-sorry if this makes no sense - as i said, i am a little drunk.

i love you guys. :(
 
John
Hi it's me fmighell in alaska.
Have a good night sleep. You don't have to keep the pain, because it's over, it happen a long time ago. It's just memory's now.
And if you have a headach take two asperins.
Let us know that you made it through the day,
O.K.
may the peace of the Lord be with you
fmighell anc ak

[ October 08, 2001: Message edited by: fmighell ]
 
Harry,

In replying to your post I feel like I am replying to a younger version of myself. The rage, the getting rid of it with alcohol, the cutting (or thoughts of it), the suicidal ideation, the rationalizations about self-medicating--I've been there. And I definitely relate to feeling fucked up beyond all repair. The words I would use were "damaged" or "lost" and I was convinced that, for me, these would always describe me.

These words/feelings do not describe me now, and they do not have to describe you. It's great that you are going to therapy. Don't give up on yourself, and don't give in to all of the self-abusive thoughts spinning in your head. Your rage is a healthy response to an insane situation. Unfortunately, that response has most likely been trapped for years, and now springs out for no apparent reason.

Fight for yourself. We're here for you.

Jeff
 
John,

The fact that you have a therapy appointment scheduled for Monday (tomorrow?) is validation that a strong voice within knows what you need to be doing. Although this is an intake interview, it is important to provide the counselor with as much information as possible in the amount of time that you have. In fact, you may wish to print out these posts and take them in, as your writings and ramblings have some pretty clear messages about what's going on for you.

You're right...it is pretty typical for students in college to utilize alcohol. That said, I know that a part of you knows that this is ultimately no long-term solution to the bad hand that has been dealt you.

Besides therapy, something else that you might think about is to make some healthy and personal connections with folks on campus. As an example, maybe you have a favorite professor whose lectures "speak" to you in some way and for whom you have personal regard. Just stopping by after class and telling him or her that you enjoyed the class, that you found it thought-provoking, etc. can be an important beginning. I know...I am a professor (who is also a sexual abuse survivor). I am teaching because I love it...and because the Universe put me there to extend the hand of friendship to folks just like you who need more than to have me fill their heads with "stuff!"

You were smart enough to find your way to this forum, John, and this is a great place to find support and to gather confidence as well as important information. My sense is that all around you there are kindred spirits who need you as much as you need them. All you need to do is to be open to their genuine love and concern.

Please stay connected and let us know how it's going!

Don
 
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