Clergy Abuse Moderators: MS Position Statement on Clergy Abuse??

[NC-Survivor]

Can/should MS develop a Position Statement / White Paper on what the Best Practices should be when Church denominations (or other houses of worship, etc.) are confronted with Child (& adult) sexual abuse by members of their Clergy/Leadership/Staff (present or past) and what should be done by the Denomination as a whole (and/or local church body) to protect and assist those victims both Identified and not yet identified.

Does that make any sense?? I know several of us here are pursuing "being heard" by the denominations where we experienced abuse. What should a reasonable end result be?? What makes sense? What would be doable?

Should a good faith effort be made not only to inform the local body of the abuse, but make a good faith effort to reach out to potential former victims, so they know help is available and that they are not alone?

***************

Ideas so far:

Financial Assistance with Therapy Bills

 

[Strangeways]

MS could write such a statement, but it seems like a rather pointless exercise to me since religious denominations do not tend to take advice from other groups. On the contrary, they do exactly what they want, which most of the time is to sweep all abuse accusations under the rug.

 

[NC-Survivor]

it seems like, on the contrary, many are looking at how to best address this issue. As more and more abuse survivors and demanding to be heard and seen (like Me with UMC, and others here with the Catholic church) what should the end result be? what is "fair"?

 

[NC-Survivor]

even a position on the MS website would be helpful: Our church now have victims approaching us about former (or current) leaders - How should we address this??

 

[Strangeways]

What's fair is to break up the religion entirely, sell off all of the assets, and give the money to the abused victims.

What really happens is usually nothing.

 

[NC-Survivor]

ok, well that is a start - but realistically *that* will never happen. what else is "reasonable"??

 

[Strangeways]

I would imagine the forced sale of assets would be a good start, as what happened to the Boston diocese. Of course, in Boston the money was used to defend the diocese against lawsuits, which is the exact opposite of what they should have done with the money.

 

[NC-Survivor]

short of Dismantling the church, what should be done to help victims??

 

[Gistin]

I think settlements are bullshit, which is just paying you for sexual services rendered against your will.
I think the church should be sent the monthly bills for everyones therapy, they should SEE every bill. Mailed with each check, should include a letter of apology and request for forgiveness.

Henry Nouwen "We need to forgive and be forgiven every day, every hour unceasingly. That is the great work of love among the fellowship of the weak that is the human family."

 

[NC-Survivor]

Financial Assistance with Therapy Bills. - good point.

 

[NC-Survivor]

Moderators.... @admin @Ivancas @JamesW @ModTeam @FormerTexan @Chase Eric

Opinions??

 

[sand shore]

[Disclaimer] NOT connected to MS officially in any way, i am expressing my own, personal opinion.
So, my personal opinion is: MS is better to stay away from any situation like that!
Why i think it's the best? Because seeking justice in any kind of abuse is not something a free confederation kind of organization can really do. Justice is a goal for institutions OR organizations aimed for justice.. It's OK and i understand, but where the hell i am going to come for my recovery goals?
There must be an organization with a focus on recovery, not on justice, and, in my experience, those two don't go well together.

I am sorry if i express something you disagree with, i mean no disrespect, it's just for me as an abuse survivor MS is a critical part of safety network and i fear i will lose it.

 

[NC-Survivor]

thank you for sharing @sand shore -- I don't know if I was looking for "Justice" but a recommended "to do" list for churches, etc. to respond when confronted with abuse (either past or present). If that makes sense. For many of us it was PAST abuse and the perpetrators are most likely deceased.

 

[sand shore]

i understand. My point is MS should try to avoid being positioned in power play as hard as it's possible. I met survivors of clergy abuse who wanted to confront church and authorities, they did that to some extend, and usually they were met with organized defense.
Of course, a church is an organization, so they will try to protect themselves no matter what.
Now, imagine MS does what you have suggested, implement some policy for organizations which hire abusers... So, the most logical thing to do for a church in difficult situation is to use it against survivors. "Oh, but we have implemented the MS policy fully, ask them." Now all survivors who use MS as a recovery resource suddenly is in confrontation with survivors who seek justice on a church in my example.. Who will enforce a policy? Who will verify people comply? There are so many dangerous and bad ways to use something like this..
I hope i am wrong and it's easy in modern world - my experience is that even female survivors aren't willing to accept there are male survivors - in general public's opinion our place is under the rug.

 

[George]

Having been involved with several churches throughout the years, most associated with mainline denominations, one without I can tell you first hand that most churches don't have the money a lot of folks think they have. Even the mainline denominations, the local body usually owns their own building, some even rent, a lot even have mortgages too. The ties that bind the local body to the denominations & vice verse are usually very loose, so loose that there is usually not much oversight or involvement. A lot of churches aren't able to even pay there ministers a living wage so they have to work a part to full time job elsewhere. The trend has seen the older smaller churches drying up because the newer bigger mega churches have all the bells and whistles with a lot more for their congregants as far as services & functions for the whole family.

I think the idea of MS putting together info for groups like churches on what to do if and when abuse is brought to light would be good to have on hand with a link to the info on the front page. This info would be good for any group where children are present because there is always a risk both past and present.

Progress; I do know that the couple of large churches that I've been a part of lately have hard and fast rules and requirements for anyone working with the kids in the church, including background checks, and never ever any one adult is ever to be alone with one child, there always must be another person present, no rooms without windows in the doors, etc. So the lessons of the past have not fallen on deaf ears. Some of the rules are to satisfy the churches insurance companies too.

 

[NC-Survivor]

Thank you, @George - that is exactly what I was talking about, a resource for churches.

 

[Gistin]

My response above is knee-jerk all the way and I do apologize for the statement.
Realistically, I don't think I'd like MS being politically or involved with a position statement.

I like what @George is saying.
I think a locked pinned post with resources would be great. However, I think providing something for survivors of clergy abuse offers great value. I've had to really dig, and lately really grateful for SNAP providing me resources. While churches may have "hard and fast rules and policies for anyone working with Kids in the Church", it is still going on! The same Catholic Church I was abused, had issues of sexual assault last year and settled.

Providing resources should help those in need for a plan of action.

 

[PRFL]

Since I am not affiliated with any church and they are not related to my CSA, my take on this is that as long as a church wants to do the right thing to prevent this from happening (or happening again), providing them with resources and information on how severely this has impacted survivors sounds reasonable to me. If the church in question is not interested and simply wants to cover up and make things go away, they probably won't bother with resources, information or recommendations. I try not to generalize that all churches are bad or that all are good, I'd rather look at it on a case by case basis. As for things like justice, compensation, etc, there are probably better avenues to pursue things like legal remedies, and such things would seem to me as being outside the scope of what MS should be, unless there's something like a dedicated legal department (which may be very expensive). Just my opinion.

 

[C. E.]

I will not presume to speak for the organization, but MaleSurvivor is a resource for survivors and not a political action arm. As such, our focus is pretty clear and uncluttered by political positions - we provide tools and resources for survivors - not best practices for abusers. We are wholly focused on providing a path for survivors and would not presume to establish one for abusers or abusive institutions. Perhaps if we feel qualified to make such position statements in the future, that may change. But - like the Leaving Neverland item on our home page, we do not paint the conversations, but merely frame them and allow other voices - like Dr. Howard Fradkin in that example, or our registrants base here in the fora - to speak to the issues.

 

[NC-Survivor]

not best practices for abusers.

This made me ROFL