Is this place safe or not?

Is this place safe or not?
Dewey2k

Dewey2k

MaleSurvivor is designed to be a safe haven we can come to in our time of need to get support surrounding our issues of abuse and life in general... or that is what it's supposed to be.

A man signed on to MS about a week ago. He was really in trouble and had nowhere to turn and no idea what to do. He went to the chatroom on a daily basis, and I spent a considerable amount of time talking with him and helping him understand that he has the power to control how things are going in his life.

Recently he went into the chatroom and was discussing a sensitive topic for him. He was then criticized for his feelings and told in no uncertain terms that he was wrong. For the last 2 days I've been trying to get him to stay, to not run away from the ONLY SOURCE OF SUPPORT HE HAS, but he won't stay. Someone here chased a survivor away, and he won't likely be back.

The moderators and admin work hard to keep MS as a safe place for us here, keeping perps out to the best of their ability, but people, it's up to us to make it a safe place for ALL survivors, and that means not attacking them and tearing them down when they are at a crucial point in their recovery. In my opinion, doing that is a form of perpetration because it brings the trauma right back to the forefront of their lives.

First, DO NO HARM

Moderators, feel free to strike this post if need be. I said what I have to say, and that's all I can do right now.
 
Dwayne, I am sure the mods are doing all they can to resolve this issue.
I hope he will be back in safety.

Not been in chat for ages, but sometimes its not a place of safety because of some of those who go there to cause trouble.

Nobody should have told him that he is wrong, its not our job to say what is right and wrong.
Not a term I would ever use, but to some there is nothing wrong with doing it.

I hope he comes back soon,

ste
 
I was in chat a few nights ago when a new member came in and was not able to articulate whether or not he was a survivor. But he was told this place was only for survivors of abuse and he was certainly not made to feel welcome. It took several of us a while to get him to even talk. He was treated really badly. I wish the chat room were less accessible to new guys. They have no clue that so many survivors have issues that flame out of control in chat and result in simply bad behavior. It's sort of a paradox, that the most immediate venue for help and feedback is also the most scary and dangerous.
All things considered, it is up to us who go there to protect the new guys from those who would treat them badly. The mods have done a good job of banning the abusive guys in the past. They are forgiving but fair when enough is enough.
Paul
 
Paul,

The example you give is exactly what I'm talking about. People new to coming here need to feel safe to be there in the first place, and then need to feel safe to share.

Imagine if someone jumped on you and made you feel like you didn't belong in a place designed for survivors. First it would definitely make me feel like I wasn't welcome here, and it would make me feel even worse about what I was dealing with. If other survivors can't help me, who can? Where can I turn to?

Yeah, this is a hot-button issue for me.
 
I agree dewey. No one on this board should tell anyone what they can and can't discuss, as long it's within the original ground rules, but unfortunately some people do!

Sadly I don't know what we can do about it. All I can say is the good guys outnumber the bad apples, on this board, by many. A there are some real legends.

But as you point out it's vital that the first attempts to call for help are dealt with sensitively and with understanding.

Mark
 
Dwayne - Thanks for recognition of the hours and hours the mods and admin. give to make MS run as smooth and safely as it does. I'm glad you are sensative to some rude and harmful members who do damage!! Those guys should be reported to Mods to resolve the injustices. There are ALWAYS mods somewhere on the site but it takes the whole community of survivors to alert to problems. It's almost like Town Watch where neighbors inform the local police to illegality. This is a place of support, help and healing!!!! If you can't help, can't support or can't help the healing...remain silent but DO NO HARM!!

Howard
 
I stopped going to chat when a certain "member" abused me there, and then went on to report me to the mods.

The mods sided with him, not me, and no way I would hurt anyone in chat unless they really have a go at me.

Go figure,

ste
 
i dont think ive ever considered MS "safe", its just a matter of weighing the positives and negatives to decide if you should stay.

since it is open to the whole internet there is just no way it can really be "safe." and even if it wasnt, there are members here, who are allowed to stay here, who are abusive and manipulative and drive others away. i am going to give the mods the benefit of the doubt and assume they have also been tricked by these people. but i know who they are, and i bet some of you reading this know as well.
 
Ah, the problems of the internet!

The problems are ones that have been around since it started, and I don't think they will go away either.
And I don't say that lightly or in any way to critisize the Mod's who do a terrific job.

The problems are ( I think :rolleyes: ) the same ones we see in real life - but amplified.

We build up levels of trust on the 'net that are quite frankly unrealistic. How much do we actually know about the people we consider friends and trust on the 'net? And would we have that same level of trust in real life? I somehow doubt it.

I'm certainly not saying "don't trust anyone, treat everyone as a potential enemy" far from it, but I think we should excercise more caution than we generally do.
And trust me here, I've had my fingers burned more than once by people who I 'knew' on the 'net who turned out to be the complete opposite of the people I thought I could trust, and believed "who they said they were."

When we meet someone face to face we see body language, we get instant responses during conversation. No matter how fucked up our lives might have been, there's always some degree of bullshit detection left working.
We have none of this online, the people we 'talk' with have time to respond, much less in chat I know, so we stand a chance of not getting the true 'gut reaction' from someone, possibly we get lies and bullshit?

Equally we can get the truth, I know that because I have learned the hard way.
I have also learned to walk away from the assholes and not let them drag me down, moderating here taught me that!

It's still a new environment, maybe the future generations will be so attuned to talking over the 'net that the problems we see today won't be an issue? I think the next generations will adapt to technology in way's we will never do.

Which is why I'm not surprised to see another post about 'behaviours' in the chat room, ( I don't use MS chat because of the time difference, but I do sometimes use chat rooms )
What I see is people using face to face expectations and behaviours in an alien environment. But what else have we got?

It's a difficult problem.

Dave
 
This is an ugly thread. The chatroom is like anywhere else. You get all kinds of different people, with all kinds of different agendas. The rule is, don't get serious in there until you have spent some time and you understand who the different players are. Simple as that. Start trusting the chatroom too soon, and you'll get hurt.

I have had one or two bad experiences in there but I simply put the people on ignore and that was that.

Maybe the chat warning needs to come up on the sign-in screen instead of hidden under the chatroom when it comes up?
 
Hello Dave,

Just wanted to let you know I am doing well in DC.

My best decision was to come here.

Hope all is well in UK, and do not be a stranger, since we have known eachother a long while.

Love Michael
 
the chat has helped more than it has hurt, you bring what you can when you sign in and know the limitations too.

I have been here long time mj is my 4 or 5 nick on chat since i am dyslexic and kept messing up login. So I have been here since 2000.

It also took me a while to figure out how to sign in to the discussion board.

Love and kindness, some time to heal, we all need it and all should have empathy, but the wounds run deep. So be patient on the chat and do not expect all your needs to be met in one hour.
 
The only way out of this problem according to me is to create a Landing Platform for all new abuse survivors who land up here totally confused, broken down and vulnerable. Tell them where they can get direct access to all our healing resources, sort of step by step program, instead of letting them straight away jump on to a chat rooms, where some old members who are still struggling with their power/control issues, do not get to misuse them to develop their self esteem, or to convert them to their personal ideology of healing and abuse.

Indulging in excessive sympathy should also be avoided, as that makes us stay wounded and healed. As many old survivors here would know how difficult it is to stop using our abuse as a 'currency' - 'you don't know what I have gone through' syndrome.

Second comes, the often visible issue of this forum being mis-used as a place to profess our rights or wrong in our opinion. Lets not do that here, there are plenty of newsroom where we can do that, here we should come 'specifically and only' to find out what works and doesn't work in our healing zone. Suggest only what has worked in giving you peace and comfort and not in getting even. Thoughts of that haven't aided in anyone healing ever. If you want to get over them, then please use this place. In other words - Use this place to heal and not to stay wounded. There is big and powerful difference between the two.

People who get stuck in the right and wrongs of the world seldom heal or find any form of solace here or else where as it comes only when we ca let go of all our power and control needs, and understand sometimes it is best to let go the control to a higher power. Just because it got misused during our childhood, that it will be misuse forever. We create our reality after all, and if we continue to believe this is an unsafe world, isn't that what we would create?

Let's post notices over chat rooms and boards for members to not make them wrestling zone for wounded egos. Avoid all abuser bashing, and turn every board into a venting zone, survivor stories is just for that, and not continue to vent years and years into recovery, if you realize the path isn't work, please let's get back to the drawing board and recreate our belief and healing module as nothing is fixed on life, not even a healing path. If everything remains so fixed we would never heal that way. It is only our new beliefs that create new possibilities to heal, become whole once again.

Lastly the formation of a clique is a peril every old support group has to face, as that happens when the in members want to retain their power over a space. All healing issues though, but can be solved by having a personalized welcome note on the front page rather making it look so clinical.

Lets also advise old members to realize that no one owns this space or has mastery over healing issues; it is only about what works for oneself. We can only share our experiences here and not our hypothesis; lets reserve that for our T.

Finally every survivor who is here must know that there is time in the healing curve when you should and must leave this place and joining the real world, you cannot drop your anchor at a support group forever. Its unhealthy and unwise. Move on, and then when you have tested and applied your healing wisdom to the real world come back again to offer new insights and wisdom to the group. Otherwise come back when you want to give back something, but never to prove a point.
 
There's not many of the old members left.

We drafted a welcome page for new members but it never went anywhere. However, if there's enough interest I can start a thread with the message to new members in it and we can see if one of the admins will make it sticky.
 
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I'd be happy to work on a welcome page. I think it's a very good idea, and should be something that is drafted by few people.

Thoughts?
 
okay this is the age old question that has been debated over and over and my feelings havent changed. this is a place for everyone. from all walks of life. from all stages of recovery to all personality types. whenever you get that diverse of people in one place there is going to be conflict. there is nothing you can do to change this. you cant penalize the person who "ran the new guy out" because he was probably just acting how he always acts. you cant penalize him for his personality. that is just rediculous. so it sucks that someone got scared away. but really? this is the internet. if someone is that touchy then he needs more time to figure stuff out before he tries to voice his opinions and experiences in a forum like this. you cant censor topics here. you cant say what is right or appropriate to discuss. this site only works when it is used to discuss abuse. we all know that everyones experiences are different and if we have a list a approved topics nothing would get done because the effects are so unpredictable. so if someone was harsh and rude, thats just how it goes. bottom line.. this site gives support but it doesnt only give support. it gives different points of views. that, in my opinion, is stronger than just saying "oh gee. your life sucks."
 
I don't think that this site gives support, and I think that expecting support from it is a bit risky. All it does is offer information on what other guys have been through and their opinions on their healing. Any "support" that is offered here is a dangerous illusion.

Support comes from people around you who know you very well and who can come over and make you dinner, chat with you, toss a ball around, etc. It requires the person to physically be there with you. I'm not sure how I could draw support from someone that I have never met and who I don't really know other than as an avatar on a forum. I would never trust someone that much without knowing them personally for years.

This site is a great resource for male survivors, and there's a lot of good information here, but it is not a substitute for therapy or for real life interaction with people. It is wise to be careful how much you expect from MS in terms of support and friendship because it will never be able to fill that role for you. Eventually you will be let down.
 
I tend to agree. It's great that people can discuss their true feelings here. There comes a problem, though, when one needs to vent in a...let's say "eloquent" fashion. Though I'm admittedly not the colorfully-verbose type (I tend to use poor and silly substitutes for more common expletives), I have no problem listening or communicating with people who feel that, at a given moment, there's simply no other way for them to express themselves. We feel bad, and we need release - that's all there is to it.

However, sometimes this expression scares away people (usually new people). The actual problem is, it seems when this happens we are forced to make a choice. Do we choose in favor of the (not yet fully known) needs of the prospective member, and protect his sensibilities in order to get him to stay, or do we choose in favor of needs of the established member, who needs to be able to express himself? For often, in the kinds of situations that crop up on the chat room, you can have one or the other, but not both.

I'll come right out and say it - I don't really like the chat room. Not in its current context. It's great to be able to talk, but it's also dangerous. First, it's difficult to articulate anything in the chat room - you can only type one or two sentences at a time, if you want to keep up with the conversation. That means you can start off saying one thing, and someone else can get ROYALLY pissed and leave before you've had a chance to type the rest of your idea, which might easily have prevented any misunderstanding had it been heard. If you're the kind of person who likes to use a lot of qualifiers in your speech (like me), you're afraid to be yourself for fear of being misinterpreted. Second, people can see the words "trigger warning" in a thread title here and avoid the thread (or at least steel themselves for the content thereof). No such thing in the chat room. Now, nothing really triggers me - I can talk and read about anything. But not everyone can. And in the chat room someone can suddenly bust out with the biggest trigger since Nagasaki. Fine by me - but it really screws with some people. At the very least, people start leaving; and that makes me feel kind of bad. Non-triggering issues are at least as important in our business as the triggering ones - people get deprived of the chance to address those issues. Of course, we can't shout down the trigger-makers, because then THEY leave, likewise deprived, which also makes me feel kind of bad. On the forum, "trigger warnings" can help avoid that issue. In chat, it cannot be avoided. Third, I attend a few other chat rooms, and one thing that occurs to me is that chat rooms, even dedicated ones, don't stay on topic easily. It's not hard to figure out why - on your lunch break at work, how often do you actually talk about job-related issues? The chat room can serve as a "lunch room"; where we, already knowing that we have some issues in common (and therefore being comfortable in each-other's company) can simply shoot the breeze. I love it: it's nice, it's cathartic - and some don't like it. It is understandably frustrating to log into an abuse survivors chat room, needing to discuss some emergent abuse-related issue, and see a bunch of people talking about football (for example). In order to fix the conflict, someone simply must leave, or stop expressing himself. Whom do we choose?

So the chat room is great, fine - but I do not like it in the context of, and would not personally endorse it as, a recovery tool - because to be frank, it sucks as a recovery tool, no other way to put it.
 
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