I wish my mother--?triggering.../ a stream of "thoughts" response to "fantasies"

I wish my mother--?triggering.../ a stream of "thoughts" response to "fantasies"

RJD

Registrant
I've learned that I have to create my own sense of safety when I'm around others,or alone. there is also a place for judgment here. When it's someone elses turn to say something insensitive I have to know it is about their own pain not mine. It would be a loving thing to do to let them know the impact their words or actions have had on me When it is my turn to be insensitive I need to hear about it from those I've hurt, it is a loving thing to do.

I wish my mother had a supportive place to go to talk about her fantasies before she started begging me to go to bed with her. I'm glad I sought help before my daughters were born because what I knew about intimacy, I had learned from her and I was pretty disgusted. Because of that, I was terrified that I would hurt my daughters. I have known many people who have vehimently hated what their parents said to them and vowed to never inflict the same words on their own kids only to catch themselves after the fact.
My brother who perped me also perped his own daughter.
My mother learned about intimacy with men from her father and grandfather. My brothers and I were in trouble from the 'git-go.'(the day she learned about men.) (Is that how to spell git-go?) From when we were born, her days with us had already been scripted. It was because her thoughts were so unmentionable that she failed to mention them,---- because there was no one who could hear what needed to be said, -- because thinking those thoughts made her evil. I believe she perped her baby brother when she was little,(she was obsessed with him, and he moved a thousand miles away,and rarely communicated) and so her silence was sealed by shame, and she believed that everything happened because she was bad. When she had intimacy needs, they were warped by her experience. I was vulnerable by my very nature as her child and by mynatural ensuing loyalty. I was also vulnerable because of cultural gender biases-- mothers don't hurt their children.
At this point in my life I have accomplished the skills for having deep intimate friendships with friends and my wife and children. I want their esteem and their love. Because of the experiences I have had around intimacy I have to be on guard that my boundaries might get fuzzy. If I let that happen I might jeapordize the friendships/relationships. However, aside from my children, if that even starts to happen, I trust that they will bring it to my attention immediately. I believe they want my esteem and love.

Jung refers to the term shadow and describes it as that part of us that we find unacceptable. He suggests that we learn to love and accept those parts of ourselves. If we fail to do this they tend to control our behavior. I see one of my shadow as the twisted version of intimacy I learned. It is what I learned, my real life experience, if I can't learn to love and accept that part of me, then I can't accept my self. I see it as what that precious wounded child learned and this adult has learned that life doesn't have to be that painful, and can make better choices than the ones I learned. I can unlearn what I've learned. A recovery expression I have heard said is,"If I keep my shadows before me I control them. If I let my shadows slip behind me (denial)then they control me." If the possibility of my being a jerk is not allowed as part of my self concept / is a way I cannot allow myself to be seen, then I run the risk of being a jerk. For example: While early on in the men's movement we gathered as men struggling with trying to redefine masculinity and each of us wanted to see ourselves as noncompetitive caring sensitive men. So what happened? We unconciously began to compete to see who was the most sensitive caring man. Sensitivety one upmanship prevailed, our shadow was our veiled aggression.
Whenever I hear statements, by myself or others, like "I would never do that," I think, Oh,Oh!
---- be gentle with yourselves
 
RJD

Your post gives me hope for my recovery. To have come from such an abusive/dysfunctional family and survived, then thrived, shows strength and courage. Facing our shadow (deamons, dark side), which I fear doing is, it seems - is the only way out.

I decided in my early 20's that I could never have a family because I couldn't guaruntee their safety. It really hasn't been an issue in my life, my intimacy issues have kept me from any meaningful intimate long-term relationships.

"I wish my mother had a supportive place to go..." you wrote. I wish my father had had the oportunity (no excuse even so) we have now to share our problems and experiences, and most of all, effective guidance/therapy to deal with abusives childhoods.

When I was 16 and stopped the abuse, I told myself 'I've got to stop the cycle' (not in those words but to that effect). 'There is no way I'll perpetuate what happened to me on another human being'. Unfortunately, I'm stuck emotionally and other ways at age 16 and younger.

I'm working with a T on getting unstuck. The journey looks like a tunnel with no light at the end. Facing the dark side, letting my inner boys of various ages have their feelings and express their hurt, anger and 'g' knows what else, seems to be my only way out.

I have to stay away from "I wish" statements. They lead me into regrets about my past. Both do nothing but make me feel worse, keeping me stuck in the past. I'm my own worse enemy, my unconscience works so hard to keep me down.

"I can unlearn what I've learned." you wrote.
RDJ, that you've learned so much and have put it to work is inspiring. Thanks for sharing.

"So what happened? We unconciously began to compete to see who was the most sensitive caring man. Sensitivety one upmanship prevailed, our shadow was our veiled aggression. " you wrote.

What a reality for me this is! I laughed when I read this. A playful part of me extends it to so many other issues... Who's the most healed? Who's had the worse abuse? Who's the wisest of them all? Who's in the most pain? Who's the most dysfunctional? Let's play "Name that Dysfunction!" I'm sometimes able to recognize when I engage in these games. I have real difficulty knowing when I'm acting out of veiled aggression.

I'm so glad I found this site. You men will have to put up with my crap now :rolleyes: I am looking for connections with others taking the road less traveled, the one toward recovery.

Jer

- Travel gently, with a sense of humor
 
RJD:

Wow! I can pretty much sum up my response by saying virtually your entire post sounded like you were me writing my story, about my mother!... :eek: :o :rolleyes:

Except I should say my late & younger brother never perped me nor I him. He was physically & mentally "retarded", and I pretty much spent my childhood years taking care of him. I'm quite sure my mother never abused him. No other siblings.

So happily, the cycle of abuse has been broken with my generation, with my daughters. They've not been abused, they're off to college, and I can't fathom them ever abusing (they know about my abuse).

I'm still struggling with intimacy issues, but have been married to a wonderful woman for almost 23 years, and its getting better all the time. I'm also learning to trust & make friends.

You wrote: "Jung refers to the term shadow and describes it as that part of us that we find unacceptable." When I thot of the shadow, I also immediately thot of "The Stranger," the album & title cut from the 70's by Billy Joel. I'd not before heard but like the recovery phrase: "If I keep my shadows before me I control them. If I let my shadows slip behind me (denial)then they control me."

Good insights about oneupmanship, and how it can happen even in recovery settings. A thot to ponder indeed.

Thanks RJD, and you be gentle with yourself, too!

Wuame
 
RJD,
Thanks for shareing this with us. All I can say is WOW! as well. It was my step-father with me, I havent talked to my brothers or sister to see if I'm alone with this or if he also abused them. Scard to know the answer I guess. I hope I can remember to keep my showdow in front of me. What a great visual, it has controlled me long enough and it's time I took controll of it. That is something me and my t are working on. Just wanted to say ty for sharing this with us.
Your Brother
James
 
RJD

Like James, I like this idea...
"If I keep my shadows before me I control them. If I let my shadows slip behind me (denial)then they control me."
I like the idea of not having to look over my shoulder any more, look ahead and see what's coming.

Lloydy
 
Thanks for your loving support guys. You have all blessed me by your responses.

A powerful image for me is" The monsters in the terrifying shadows of night lose their power as soon as I turn on the light switch and can see the slipper under the bed for what it really is."
Patterns of my fears hold me back. "I'm shit", "If you really knew me you would hate me", "Everyone I come into contact with becomes contaminated," I don't deserve to have good thing happen to me," have been some of my lifelong demons/monsters. These demons were a way of life for me.
To turn on the light by seeking support/therapy/telling my secrets carried a life and death level of fear. Who would I be without the terror I lived.
Then (many years later)I read, "It is not our shadows we fear, it is our light." Wow!-- It shifted my focus of overcoming my fears to embracing my light. I think it helped give me the strength to believe I deserved good things. I went back to school and turned my academic track record around. Some of you know I have recently completed a masters program. To do so was to step into my light. My shadow said, "they made a big mistake accepting you into their program, you know better," but I managed to keep my light in focus.
I still have much work to do ------------ RJD
 
Jer:

Brother, we're all about taking each other's crap, as we travel the road less traveled, Recovery Road. Welcome to our expedition party!

Wuame
 
Then (many years later)I read, "It is not our shadows we fear, it is our light." Wow!--It shifted my focus of overcoming my fears to embracing my light. I think it helped give me the strength to believe I deserved good things
Great quote! This also shifts the focus from what we're recovering from to what we're recovering to. To the good things we do all deserve.

I went back to school and turned my academic track record around. Some of you know I have recently completed a masters program. To do so was to step into my light. My shadow said, "they made a big mistake accepting you into their program, you know better," but I managed to keep my light in focus.
Obviously, "the shadow" was wrong, as "it" usually is. BTW what did you get your masters in?

I still have much work to do --RJD
Don't we all bro? Im glad you managed to keep your light in focus, and for your inspiration to help me, and many here I'm sure, do the same.

Take care

Wuame
 
Hi RJD,

Your posts are really worth reading. Thanks for opening up your wisdom to us.

We seem to accept an awful lot os lies about ourselves. By your bringing them into the light we all see the lies and lifetraps we have lived by.

I see you have been around for a long time on this forum. I hope we continue to hear of your wisdom and experiences in exorcising your demons.

Bob
 
I can relate well to the shadow. Of course mine was all around me. Wherever I went, whatever I did, and wherever I turnedit was there. I learned to fear it and despise it, yet I let it take over.

Learning of my abuse shed some light on my shadow. My recovery was about dispelling the shadow, not controlling it. Knowing, where the dark spots of my life came from, was the key to eliminating them.

I spent many years trying to adapt to my situation and never managed to succeed. For me that was trying to control my shadow. I finally made a change. I learned why I did things and why I thought things, and then I quit doing and thinking in that way. I accepted my shadows as part of who I was, not who I am. That implies a change took place, and it did. I accepted my abuse, how it affected me, and what I did because of it as part of who I was. The recovered me does not let any of the old dark side influence me. It no longer has any power over me.

When I think of trying to control my shadow, I think of Peter Pan chasing down his shadow and trying to stick it to his feet with soap. It didnt work for him & I doubt it will work for us.

Jer, welcome to this functional junction on the road to recovery.

Devon
 
jer you said,
"What a reality for me this is! I laughed when I read this. A playful part of me extends it to so many other issues...
Who's the most healed? Who's had the worse abuse? Who's the wisest of them all? Who's in the most pain?
Who's the most dysfunctional? Let's play "Name that Dysfunction!" I'm sometimes able to recognize when I
engage in these games. I have real difficulty knowing when I'm acting out of veiled aggression.


I'm glad you went where you did with this playing with it. It sounds like your sense of humor is a big, strong part of your survivor resilience. A T once remarked at my sense of humor in my ability to laugh at myself. Another said I had made he first joke about incest that was actually funny, So here it is "My family is into insects and it still bugs me." OK so I'm not Robin williams. Anyway I often find myself saying, "I'm doing it again". Your statement had me grinnin ear to ear. Thank you jer. And I look forward to more of your "crap"
 
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