How can I help my CSA Husband see what I see?

[WontGiveUp]

I love my dear husband beyond belief. To the ends of the earth and anything beyond. He has suffered horribly in his past, and because of that he cant see himself for what he really is. He loathes himself, doesn't respect himself, doesnt believe he deserve happiness and joy, and doesnt think he ever WILL deserve it. He is wrong. But he cant see it because he is in that hole of shame and guilt - that should not even belong to him.

He has nothing to be ashamed of and nothing to feel guilty about. He is amazing, wonderful, beautiful, intellegent, talented, spirited, courageous, loving, kind beyond compare, gentle....I could go on and on. I wrote him a 5 page letter once telling him all the things I love about him - and each line was a specific example. I was very careful to avoid anything about looks or sex because I wanted him to know I saw him as far more than anything like that.

He read it and said thank you - but I know he still doesnt see it. Do any of you wish you could just have your loved one be able to see themselves how you see them - even for just 5 minutes? I just wish he could, because then he could be as amazed as I am at who he is inside.

He is NOT the abuse.
He is NOT the abuser.
He is NOT the guilty one.
He is NOT the one who should feel shame.

He is an innocent who was robbed of so much. It breaks my heart.

He acts out with passive aggressiveness towards me, and has moved out of our home because of his fear of never getting past it all and thinking he can shield me and not hurt me by leaving. I know the bad behavior is not him, I know its because of what he went through. But at the same time I think he finally has found it in himself to take a stand and fight for himself. I want to help him heal and succeed so i am doing everything I can to keep communication open and be there for him. For the first time he is seeking support groups and specialists to help him get through this.

I am hopeful for the first time and extatic that he is taking these steps. The friends he moved in with are going to join with me and his family to be his support as he makes this push to heal.

I just wish I knew how to help him more. I wish I knew how to get him to see who he really is outside of the fear and self loathing. Any ideas?

Do any of the survivors here have any insight to this? I refuse to give up on him, even though he said I should.

 

[WontGiveUp]

I also want to say that he thinks he can never "be the man I deserve and need"..... the fact of the matter he already IS that man. He is the only human on earth who knows when something is wrong with only the slightest change in my expression. He is the only who will ask if I am ok, he is the one who takes care of me with making me laugh and smile and feel love, me makes sure I have what I need for all my business trips and for work, and who never hesitates to help me in anything... He is already that man who gives me what I want and need... We have issues just like every other married couple out there - nothing we cannot face together, and he cant see is how much better off we are than so many others who are not survivors. We are not just husband and wife, but we are best friends and had been for years before we were involved romantically. I cant imagine anyone else I would rather play a game with, or watch a movie with or just sit quietly bored on the couch. On paper, we have it all. He already is everything I need and everything I want - its just that sometimes he shuts down and gets lost in his fears and self doubt and self hatred. And mostly fear of hurting me and disappointing me.

I think it stems from his fear and inability to see the good in himself, and always feeling like a failure. He lets the good slide off his back and absorbs the bad. How do I help him learn about how good and awesome he is?

 

[pittsburgh]

He is a lucky man to have you. It sounds to me like you are doing all the right things. It is sad that a man who has had abuse at a early age. Has his thinking and view of his place in the world skewed for life. The really sad thing is we don't know it, we just are not aware of some of the things we are doing. Each of us handle it in different ways. With me I did not know at the time where all my anger was coming from. It took several years with of professional help and a very, very patient wife. I wish you all the best. I hope both of you are in counseling. It does help to under stand things better.

 

[md4e]

Dear Wontgiveup,
Thank you so much for writing today, I had to do a double take and make sure I hadn't written this. I too am married to the sweetest kindest most generous man. But at the same time to me he disociates. We dove 130 miles today without him speaking. Incest stole my spouse, locked him away from me. I know he's in there, I've seen him, and can't get over the bright light that is in him when he is present.
My life is one of hardship not ease because of the abuse, I choose to work over time so family and friends feel his "real" self. Not the man that freezes.
All of this is so hard.....living crazy. It is crazy to sexually abuse children. Leaves them with actions and words not matching....which in turn feels crazy.
Some days I can do it pretty and others not so much....tears, yelling etc
And today I really needed to hear from someone who understands. ..
THANK YOU

 

[Banjo596]

What a beautiful post. I hope all the best for you. What a terrible thing CSA can do to us. Your love sounds so strong it gives me faith.

 

[Daryl X.]

He's so very lucky to have you! Not only do you see it all, you express it so well. It's fantastic he's taking these steps, because that's the best hope for him to heal. Be patient, though, since it sounds like there's a lot of self-blame he'll have to let go of. It can take a long time. Don't give up.

 

[Castle]

He lets the good slide off his back and absorbs the bad.

This makes me metal.

 

[WontGiveUp]

Thankyou Everyone. I really appreciate the replies so much. Its a very hard place to be in. I love this forum, and the people here... you make me feel not alone in this, and it helps knowing my beautiful husband isnt alone either.

I will never ever give up on him. Every day it hurts, but every day I live in my faith that he will come home and one day see himself as he truly is.

 

[winter-rain]

the original post is well written and so full of love, I cant bear to be alone anymore... I want love too!
thanks

 

[1in6]

Dear WontGiveUp,

My God. What a beautiful post. I am so happy to have read it and so hopeful that your husband will heal enough to learn that what you have said is true. The things you have said about how you see him are quite similar to the things my wife says about me. I am now comfortable with hearing her say that I'm beautiful. That used to be a huge trigger for me because my two abusers used to say it while they were abusing me. But I see it differently now. I see that it is HER perception and no one else's.

I dearly hope your husband can get to the point where he can make that differentiation as well.

I felt like a fool for a long time. I thought of myself as a well trained dog who kept living the way that my abusers had trained me to live even after they were gone. I hated them for how I perceived myself and I hated myself for what letting myself engage in a lifestyle that was incredibly confusing to me for decades. I have recently had a conversation with the first really great therapist I have encountered in which I realized what I already knew my whole life. I happen to be a bisexual man. I don't hate myself for it anymore. And I see that those two people saw it in me and exploited who I was. I'm not suggesting that this is the case with any other guy who was abused, but I am hoping that he can find some peace with himself and understand that he isn't filthy or broken.

I am hoping for you two to be together again and hoping that he will find peace and confidence that he is exactly as you see him

My best wishes

William

 

[HealingHope]

Hi wontgiveup

Thank you so much for sharing the love you have for your husband. I'm in a similar place if that helps to know? My love shows such similar beliefs about himself. Reading your post has helped me, so thank you. Please know you're not alone. For me I'm learning to be patient, allow him space to work through what he's coping with. I've tried, like you telling him how much he's loved and that none of it was his fault, but he needs that to come to him in his own time.
I've taken myself recently on a survivors course to understand the recovery process and how the trauma heals. This has given me some peace.
I trust in love, I know and he knows we love each other, he just needs me to be there when he can come back to me.
I feel how overwhelmed you are, you're not alone in this. Take good care, look after yourself so that you're the best you can be for him. He needs your strength

 

[dark empathy]

Hi Won't give up.

I will say I do the same. Worthlessness, self hatred, feeling that I am diseased (a favourite term of the abusers), has been part of me for such a long time it's nearly impossible to think of myself any other way. This even went for things I did, indeed when things got really bad I could barely manage to work or write sinse I'd assume everything I said was crap just because I! wrote it, likewise if there was a problem i knew I caused it. Often I'd be so afraid to cause a problem to others even shop keepers I'd do anything to extracate myself from situations, especially in public.

My Fiance has said it's the only thing that really exasperates her about me, she will describe me very kindly, say how much she loves me, talk about how gentle or intelligent or kind etc I am or how I take care of her, and it'll feel to me almost as though she's talking about someone else. My big defense has always been that people liked me, but that was because they were terribly nice and decent people who could bare to be around me.

One thing which helped me was learning to perform a mental separation.
I could not, for years think of myself differently, my personal statistics would always read "five foot ten, dark hair, worthless!" Likewise, I always appologised almost to a chronic level.
I learnt however when I started recovery that while I couldn't necessarily silence that voice, the part of myself I called "shadow" I could at least recognize it.

For me, the abuse was at least obvious. There was no pretense of intimacy or anything else, it was blatant public humiliation and insults, albeit I did feel for a long while that I deserved it or brought it on myself. Sinse however it was so blatant, I did learn to try to separate out my inner cryticisms, to think "well I! don't know the truth about myself"

That has been difficult in the extreme, particularly alone but it has helped.

Ironically, I am now seeing something of the other side of this, sinse my fiance has (for her own reasons), a tendency to behave the same way, albeit she says I'm probably far worse at thinking less of myself than she is, and she is fully aware what she's doing.

My fiance however has been extremely patient in reassuring me, especially around love making and my genophobia, sinse I am mortally afraid of harming her, and it's just something we work at.

Two things which she has done which help, are firstly letting me know how much I love her. I have always assumed that my friends, even my parents (my abuse happened at school), were nice to me because they were good and ecent people. For some reason though with my lady, I know! she loves me, and not just because she told me, not even just because she's travelled halfways across the world to be with me. I know! she loves me, and knowing that makes me feel safe even though I do have moments of farely extreme inadequacy and worry, either that I'll hurt her or that I'll be unworthy of her or unable to help her to be happy.

The second thing however, is just discussing things. My lady is also my best friend, we can do so much together, or indeed just be together in silence. We communicate a huge amount, verbally, physically, spiritually, and ond as part of the communication we do share histories and our feelings about them. It's not therapy or councilling, it's just loving someone very much that you share yourself in a very complete and intimate way.

This goes for heras much as me, indeed she worries herself especially when discussing some of her past, less than savory relationships with me.

So, that sort of open, intimate dialogue and sharing, even about casual things helps hugely, heck I've found my fiance is the only person I can actually discuss my abuse with almost casually, for all she's said she'd extremely angry at my abusers and would like to tare some faces off (which for a person as gentle and none violent as my lady is quite shocking, though admitedly I don't exactly feel kindly about people who've hurt her in the past).


while I'm really sorry to hear about your h won't give up, at the same time from my limited experience it does sound like you and he have found something beautiful which will! help.
For me at least, the hoary old cliche did actually prove true, it's amazing how much healing I found and am indeed still finding just from learning to love and be loved in return, especially! around my genophobia.

Luke.

 

[Acorn2Oak]

Hi Wontgiveup,

male survivor here. Gosh, first: You're amazing! and he's very lucky to have you. Your post really tugged at my heart-strings. Hopefully my response will offer some useful insight.

As I read all the posts, I began to put myself in his shoes (well, I kinda AM, given the similarities). And yet, this is my experience and perspectives and may not apply to him/you at all.

The nice guy self of me is like a separate self, different and apparently not connected to the broken self which to me is far more obvious, prevalent and influential. It's easy to be attentive, considerate and caring. It's generally as natural to me as breathing.

Of course, I can never be nice enough, good enough, normal enough, man enough, etc enough to deserve that kind and degree of love, appreciation, reciprocation. I don't "think" that is true, I "know" (believe) it so deeply that it can be hard to see anything else. And yet, I have occasionally felt a connection with someone that I interpret to mean I am safe and accepted, genuinely appreciated. I can manage that better at a distance. with people I don't feel obligated to. Otherwise, it feels like any love i feel, any appreciation I receive, comes with a pricetag, perhaps a price too great to pay. That's my abuse history talking, but absent other more convincing voices, i tend to default to that.

Will I still be nice tomorrow? What if i disappoint her? what if she gets finally tired of my failure to be (my previously conditioned assumptions of what i should be - which usually speak far louder than most accolades I may get today). But then, in my family of origin, every nice thing they did for me - food, clothing, shelter, "gifts" came at a price -- invariably a price I couldn't pay.

If someone expresses appreciation to me, even appreciation I sense is sincere with no strings attached, I generally either dismiss it or get anxious, afraid i will fail sooner or later or she will get tired of my failures sooner or later. So I dismiss it so I WON'T get anxious or feel too obligated beyond that moment. I don't dare take credit for something today that I know full well I may not be able to do tomorrow, or on demand, or just whenever she may need me to at some point in the future.

Of course, some part of me also assumes a compliment is offered to encourage/ensure more of the same. But even if I have, even if I want to, even if it is usually easy to be/do whatever it was that she appreciates, I can't be sure I will be able to keep it up. The thought I may disappoint her can be quite unsettling. I can be pretty sure I'll hit a depression slump, get dissociated, have a flashback or panic attack, rendering me unable to function in ways she appreciates.

Maybe that's not an abuse thing, but just a guy thing in this culture. we are rewarded for doing, for performance. However, seems to me that according to the culture (USA at least) the list of things men are supposed to be good at no matter what is rather short (sex and money and we all know you can do without the sex and these days probably don't need the money either)and there are NO substitutes or exceptions allowed. Thus equating reward with performance, (you will only love me as long as I continue to satisfy your expectations} and worrying that we may not be able to perform or continue to perform, I'm too busy preparing for and protecting myself from the anticipated day I will fail and lose her to any one of the million other guys out there better than me at the things I believe i should be good at, or at least able to do/be consistently.

Pretty much the only thing I'm consistent about is INconsistency.

In my case, I'm not sure why my partner stays with me. Well, she says pretty much same things you did about yours. And yet, that makes no sense to me. Those reasons aren't good enough. They are, to her, and I guess that's OK. silently, in the back of my mind, I "know" better though. Will I ever truly receive, hear, accept her appreciation? Hmm. Maybe, if I can ever accept that the person I am is indeed what she wants, loves, appreciates ... that its Ok to be what I am, even if it's not what childhood, religious, and cultural conditioning tells me I should be, have to be.

I wish I had more definitive answers (another thing I'm supposed to be good at). However, I trust/hope you may be able to glean something useful from this. I sincerely wish you both well and good luck in your process.

 

[WontGiveUp]

Wow... it had been a while since I was on the forum, recently coming back. I was reading some of my older posts and saw all the new replies to this one.

I am overwhelmed and so moved by everything you guys said...

Winter-Rain, I hope you found that love you wanted, you for SURE are worthy of it.

1in6 (William) how wonderful that you have been able to accept your wife's perception of you. She is right - you are beautiful and amazing. You are not what the abusers tried to teach you. I hope that you can continue to grow and live in the love you have with your wife. I am so glad you have come to terms with who you truly are - because that is amazing! You are defining who you are on your own terms, and that right there is strength!

HealingHope - gosh, seems we are fighting the long hard fight arent we? Keep your head up, hang on to that hope you have. You will make it through my friend.

Dark_Empathy (Luke) Oh gosh, I am SO amazed by your ability to realize love. Love can give you so much power! Its wonderful that you can accept that you are worthy of the love you are given and truly accept it. My H is alot like you in that he has felt unworthy, so much self hate. He says he knows I love him, but that he cannot love me back. It has broken my heart and spirit and I am working very hard to build myself back up. I feel like what we had was very beautiful too- still do. I only wish he felt the same. But he has given up on himself, and it breaks my heart. I would give anything to to just give him 5 minutes seeing himself as I see him. Because then he would see something amazing and beautiful. He has put his mask back on though. I love that you and your lady discuss things - that openness seems to be the magic key in so many ways. My H and I used to be best friends too, but he started expressing anger and blame about what happened to him towards me. Our counseler calls it 'transferrence'. Once that started, all our openness and talking seemed to end. I, like your lady, am ready to tear off some faces too - the anger and hatred I feel for my husbands abusers ... its endless. Barely in control at times to be honest. I feel like they have robbed him of so many things, and there is no justice that they have lived their lives scot free. Oh man... I am right there with your lady 100%. Thankyou so much for your kindness too - I appreciate all the input you have given in the forum... you are so open! Its very appreciated!

Acorn2Oak - First, I LOVE your screen name. My grandpa used to tell me I was his little acorn to his oak tree. So that will always be special to me. Your description of two selves is amazing, and sounds so much like what my husband does. And your fears you expressed? I know he has them too - he has told me! I know he has told me that he fears abandonment, that he already knows he will mess things up so might as well end it. He has had that attitude for 80% of our relationship. What you said about being able to "keep up" the good things you are getting compliemented on... man, its like you are dialing right into my husband with such similarities. I need to digest your post some more, because its very eye opening, and very overwhelming to me. You are saying things almost word for word what my husband has said over time. And yes, your words have given me SO much... I cannot thank you enough. Really - seeing your perspective on whats going on, and seeing how even when expressing kindness and love to my husband can seem almost hurtful.. gosh.. so much to think about. Really - this is amazing.



Everyone - I seriously cannot thank you enough for your kind replies. Its given me so much in such a dark time.

 

[HealingHope]

Thank you WGU, take good care too.