Gay fantasies in my head, attracted to women on the street.

healing2019

Registrant
Hi
This is my first message here.
my background:
  • I suffered 'mild' abuse by a older male cousin when i was ten (forced open mouth kissing - to this day I don't know if it was just intense hazing or sexual but i felt disgusted afterwards. ) He did it twice and now I realize I went into a depression afterwards.
  • Mother eroticized our relationship made again 'minor' sexual abuse like pinching my rear end in a sexual manner when i was a teenager, and hugging me in a romantic manner - i would get revolted and back away.
  • Divorced parents. A nice father but never showed emotion, mother would constantly (and i learned later in life falsely) bad mouth him
In high school when i was 'discovering' my sexual self, I remember trying to masturbate and just couldn't really 'get off' on the girls I was super attracted to. In real life, sorry to be graphic but when I saw a girls' nice ass, I just wanted to dive in! but when masturbating, I thought 'i don't deserve her' and could only masturbate about the gay kid performing oral sex or fat girls no one wanted.. I also put girls I was in love with on a pedestal and would not even 'taint' my yearing by masturbating about them...

So it soon became that my internal head fantasies were all gay and very intense. Over the years they grew. I tried to act out when drunk with a transsexual ones, but was revolted... but a few years ago I started to feel more and more 'gay' and went as far as to post on sexual identity forums and start to 'come out' I was willing to accept that maybe I was a surpressed homosexual. But something just wasn't right. I always looked at women on the street and lusted after them but I was internally blocked when it came to getting aroused.. oh that's just 'repression' people told me, but it never budged. Real gay guys 'gross me out' when I think about having sex with them ( I don't mean this to offend gay guys, just that I feel revolted at the thought of sex) yet I have these intense internal fantasies..

To further complicate things, if I look in the mirror and say "I am gay" it feels very good and warm, but I only feel this way during high stress anxious times.

But again on the street, I love looking at women's bodies and have a gut reaction that I want to touch them, smell them, be intimate with them... don't ever feel that way about men.

Does anyone experience anything similar?
 

Rwfox99

Registrant
I have thoughts, just like that. But I used to act on them. I would meet guys in parks for some mutual gratification. Then I would feel like shit. I never have seen a guy and said he is fine. Guys are just guys in my head, no attraction at all. Women on the the other hand have always been attractive and yes I can pick out a few I would fuck. I was assaulted by a guy for a year and for some reason I get sexual fantasy of me dominating other men now. I wish I could get it out of my head. Hope we can find some peace on this site.
 
It’s actually something a lot of survivors deal with.

It might be helpful for you to read this thread...

 

healing2019

Registrant
Then I would feel like shit.
to me this is the indicator that we have some need but it's a negative coping strategy. and not necessarily just because its SSA.

If I go out and have a couple of drinks ( and I can) or ONCE in awhile over indulge at a fun party I don't feel bad - if I am drinking as a way to cope with stress on a regular basis wake up hungover, or simple sat at home and drank as a way to deal with anxiety then I feel bad...

I usually get these "gay' 'ssa' feelings during high anxiety and /or long periods of isolation. Usually going out on the street and seeing women 'cures' it.

It might be helpful for you to read this thread.
Thanks!
 
Excellent site to the Joe Kort Article sdd757. I wish that and the consumers guide to picking s therapist were pinned at the top of the survivor thread.
 

healing2019

Registrant
Excellent site to the Joe Kort Article sdd757. I wish that and the consumers guide to picking s therapist were pinned at the top of the survivor thread.
Thanks. Too many people - sexuality forums, therapists, society in general are too quick to pin labels on behaviors.
I have found yourbrainonporn.com useful for issues of sexual malability, escalation and making it clear that pornography at least, can be completely out of wack with one's innate sexuality.

Its hard to find information about internal fantasies which are in a sense 'porn for the brain' - but I think at least some are symbolic of other needs that have been sexualized.

I have learned to accept them but, the same way i got off of some self medicated drinking - I don't want to continue to "use" them - I want to get at the root of whatever need they are trying to fulfill.
 

healing2019

Registrant
To further complicate things, if I look in the mirror and say "I am gay" it feels very good and warm, but I only feel this way during high stress anxious times.
this is how I am feeling now. Sometimes -what adds to the confusion - is that its warm and comforting, and maybe I am just blocking acceptance? but a drug can feel like that too... and once I go outside the feeling largely goes away and my eyes are on women...

the shame the lack of confidence - perhaps that all leads to isolation - thinking "i am not worthy' -
 

healing2019

Registrant
I just had an incredible revelation in shower - and literally leaped out to write this while I remember.
I get these 'gay' fantasies - for comfort and arousal and intimacy - when I have fears about not being a 'man' or scared' or am questioning myself - its literally an escape from responsibility, from challenges - literally having a cold shower and just listening to a motivational youtube video (or even recalling it) about overcoming challenges, facing up to fears, I literally looked in the mirror and instead of spontaneously saying 'i am gay' and getting a warm feeling (like escape?) I said I deserve (in the sense of worthy of) a good woman ( prior to all of this I was thinking about one that I liked). That didn't feel like warm escape it felt like a good but tough coach saying ' get after it!'

I also think the 'gay' fantasies since it's an idealized figure and often sex sexual is a form of unhealthy narcassism -- instead of healthy self care and self esteem.
 

MACH123

Registrant
Misuse of terms here IMHO. Labels are one of the biggest problems in all this. "Just because the cat has kittens in the oven that don't make them biscuits." Just because I was taught to do sexual behaviors when I was too young to understand them doesn't mean I belong to a certain group.

My sexuality was inherited. I was created. Gender has much less to do with it than I used to think and everything to do with it at the same time? Girls don't usually force you to perform sex acts. They force in other ways, God bless them! : )

My question was always not if I was, but why wasn't I, and along those lines, now what?

But now what has been a long drawn out mis match. Everything that happened happened. I'm very feminine, but I don't go advertise that around the men. It's not a good idea. I stuck with women therapists and doctors and lovers.
 
I also think the 'gay' fantasies since it's an idealized figure and often sex sexual is a form of unhealthy narcassism -- instead of healthy self care and self esteem.
Yes!! It is not about being homosexual. It is about being sexualized by another male, having a too close relation with mother (emotional incest - very strong words but often very true) and having a distant father. That is a toxic stew that often results in the quote of yours above - idealizing other men as some form of "other - I'm not like them" or "I can never be like them" due to father absence, being too connected to mother and throw in an older male using you for sexual touch, it crosses wires and leads to being up in one's head and fantasizing about connection to men that has improperly been sexualized. I believe a big part of it is that the sexualizing by the older male happens in secret and no one addresses it and a boy being left alone to figure it all out can easily lead to confused sexuality.

Here's the thing. Fantasies or even acting out the fantasies have nothing to do with orientation. They are separate and should be seen that way. The fantasies and acting out for me were my defective way of trying to connect to my own maleness. But I don't blame myself for what I did the more work that I do. I understand a lot happened in secret, I had no way to connect with men except the sexualization by another male and I needed to bond with men. I was a lonely, abused, neglected boy trying to bond with men as it is human, male nature to bond with men. Sexualization of boys by older males (or males in authority in some way) screws us up and results in confusion for many of us (and maybe there are similarities for male victims of female abuse - I don't know but don't want to exclude anyone).

For me, it has been quite the journey getting beyond accepting my confusion as my orientation since it seems or feels that many wanted me to accept my confusion as my orientation. Not true, not true at all.
 

healing2019

Registrant
Fantasies or even acting out the fantasies have nothing to do with orientation.
Yes! It took a long time for me - partially I think because our society sexualizes everything....to realize this - my natural tastes on the street and my natural sex drive feels very different from the internal angst-ridden fantasy - too many 'experts' telling us that's our orientation -so act it out and well if you feel weird about it its just your homophobia - to me it is as mis-wired as attaching relief from fear and anxiety and internal shame by shooting heroin -

I too have learned to not guilt trip myself about these fantasies - and paradoxically the more i accept them without anxiety the less pull they have.
 
Yes! It took a long time for me - partially I think because our society sexualizes everything....to realize this - my natural tastes on the street and my natural sex drive feels very different from the internal angst-ridden fantasy - too many 'experts' telling us that's our orientation -so act it out and well if you feel weird about it its just your homophobia - to me it is as mis-wired as attaching relief from fear and anxiety and internal shame by shooting heroin -

I too have learned to not guilt trip myself about these fantasies - and paradoxically the more i accept them without anxiety the less pull they have.
Sexuality is way more complicated than labels...
 
too many 'experts' telling us that's our orientation
That is so, so, so sadly true!

It even happens on here, lol (not really "lol").

"Experts" on orientation often have a reason for being "experts" and I have found that people all trained in the same programs in the same schools with the same texts are "trained" to have an outcome in mind and cannot tolerate anything outside of that outcome even for survivors. I've met some who actually don't simply toe the line and understand these issues but they are few and far between in my experience.
 
Appreciate this conversation. Thank you Ed for your comments. This is pretty much where I've landed on this topic. The confusion over both sexual orientation and gender wracked my mind for a long time, carrying with it profound shame. Recognizing it all as a perpetuation of the trauma helps greatly in putting it all to rest. I feel my attraction to women is more fundamental to me than any of the acting out behavior I've done over a lifetime. No judgment about those who make other choices but I believe honestly that we can only come to our truth on this once we've been able to unpack the trauma and find some self-compassion and mobilize self-care. Any form of acting out is bound to have distortions in it. We need the peace and serenity that allow us simply to embrace our aliveness. Needless to say, for trauma survivors this is the work of a lifetime.
 

healing2019

Registrant
Thank you Ed for your comments.
agreed! Very helpful.
feel my attraction to women is more fundamental to me than any of the acting out behavior I've done over a lifetime.
when i finally faced this (one reason that led me here) I realized with observation that my sexual arousal for men and women was very different - it wasn't 'bisexual' i slowly realized that the SSA fantasies were anxiety based and completely internal- it took a lot self awareness and introspection but one feels like a 'hijacking' of the sex drive - like anxiety based eating and one feels natural - I naturally look at women on the street and when I don't feel alienated, I am sexually aroused also - alienation brings the SSA fantasies.

No judgment about those who make other choices
I understand your viewpoint but the LGBTQ activists have done an great disservice to childhood victims of same sex abuse - they have trampled over us pursuing their agenda....any therapist, counselor who dare say that SSA is anything but closeted homosexuality is immediately ostracized. I tried to ask honest questions on sexuality forums and all I was told is i have 'internalized homophobia'

. The confusion over both sexual orientation and gender wracked my mind for a long time, carrying with it profound shame. Recognizing it all as a perpetuation of the trauma helps greatly in putting it all to rest. I
facing it accepting it reduced the anxiety and subsequently the pull.
 
any therapist, counselor who dare say that SSA is anything but closeted homosexuality is immediately ostracized.
YES!!! I had one of the best therapists that I've ever had (he was a genuinely compassionate man) who told me that research regarding sexuality that didn't match the current agenda of the APA and professional community was being done but it was pushed to the fringes and not allowed into the greater conversation.

We have to pick our "experts" wisely. There are those who are sophisticated and above the fray of the current dogma on male sexuality and orientation issues but they are few and far between and under the threat of attack at any minute. That's not hyperbole or exaggeration.

I don't want to smear this thread as it has allowed me a place to grow, vent and listen (maybe not in that order, maybe in that order). I want to say that I use a tool on this thread that has been great - "Ignore". I've used it very sparingly but I now know that if I post on this thread and someone disruptive or "threatening" chimes in, I can ignore and talk with open men and not just like-minded men but open men. That has made this sub forum a much better place - for me.
 
Fellows, lighten up. My therapist made no such assertion about my anonymous sex with men, rather, he characterized it as a re-enactment of the sexual abuse. Setting up straw men to make a point does nothing to a conversation except invite controversy. This seems to be bubbling about on the website at the moment. Personally, I have NO interest in going there and I certainly don't need to have my opinion on anything prevail when it comes to healing from sexual trauma. I need all the help I can get from everyone who has experienced this horror, gay, straight, bi, non-binary, transgendered. We all came to our suffering through no fault of our own and what we did to survive is simply what we did to survive. The only thing that matters is healing and we've all learned over the years that we can't do it alone. We need support and from my experience, the support that matters is from other men who've known this horror from first hand experience. I'll hang out with them, with you.
 
I wrote a long reply but don't need it.

I don't agree with all you've written, Visitor, but i understand that you're pulling this thread back from the edge. That's fair
 
Thanks Ed. We honestly don't need to agree on everything... this journey is remarkably complex and each of us has worked hard to find meaning for ourselves as we struggle to claim our aliveness. There clearly is no "one size fits all" experience here. What we share is simply the fact that we experienced trauma and are trying to find relief with the help of other men like ourselves. I hope we can keep this website as a sanctuary where we can support one another in this work. What unites us is much more important, in my opinion, than anything that divides us.

Off my soapbox now. Enjoy the day everyone.
 
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