Family Enmeshment

[Sleepy]

I know that this topic isn't directly related to the issues that this site deals with. However, everyone here seems to share a very dysfunctional family background. And maybe I can gain some insight into this topic.

If anyone has noticed I've haven't been too active in MS within the last month or two. Truthfully, I'm not too sure why. But within this time I have changed Ts and in a very strange way have become more comfortable with myself sexually. Seemingly, things are going fairly well.

But when things seem to be going well, for some reason something else will rear it's ugly head. For all the newbies here and those who may have forgotten, I graduated college last year and then immediately moved back home. Home has always had a strong pull on me, though I always thought I would eventually feel comfortable enough to leave the safe home environment. The problem is that I'm 25 and really struggling with becoming independent.

In the recent past I thought it was simply a result of the SA perpetrated by my sister. It must have made me co-dependant or something like that. You know, it's an easy excuse. But with the aid of my new T it is becoming clearer that the family dynamic may be the heart of the problem (though the sexual confusion stemming from the SA may not help the situation). This is very difficult to understand because I always thought my family was completely "normal." However as I look at how the family operates it seems like boundaries tend to merge in areas where it shouldn't. And there are probably boundaries that merge where I don't even know they merge. The result from all this is that I don't think it fosters independence. In fact, some of my recent anxiety attacks are clearly linked to this issue.

For sake of understandability, I won't go into depth about specific issues. There are just too many and it can make this post hard to follow. But, in general, I feel that subconsciously they don't want me to leave. My dad, in particular, has lost both his parents in tragic ways and he may not want to lose me too. My mom is passive and defers everything to my dad. Unfortunately, my dad is incredibly passive as well and so nobody is ever really there to provide for any emotional guidance. I liken it to a form of a passive emotional neglect. So where does this leave me? I guess I'm kind of stuck, at least for right now.

This T has been pretty good. We even had a joint meeting with my parents last Wednesday. Overall it was uneventful, but I think more joint sessions are necessary. There are many more issues that need to be addressed. Unfortunately it's necessary to have a facilitator to foster communication between my parents and myself. I know that one joint session won't change things.

I must say that I am fortunate that my parents indeed love me and will do everything they can to help me, even if it requires action on their behalf. It also hurts me to have to keep the SA a secret. If they ever found out about what my sister did to me it would really hurt them and it would disrupt the family just too much. But it's unfortunately that they'll never know exactly what I'm going through. If they had a clearer picture it would certainly help me a lot.

I guess my reason for posting this is to see how others have dealt with an enmeshed family. I'm also curious if anyone knows of some good books on this subject. I would greatly appreciate it. Enough for now.
Thanks all,
Mike

 

[outis]

Mike,

I'm not sure about enmeshed, but I do know that my family are the folks that put the "fun" in "dysfunctional."

I remember coming home late, around 11:00 or later one night, with my brother and telling him on our walk home that I wouldn't stand for any punishment over being late, because I was "seven years old and could take care of myself." I only remember that because I remember not being punished, i.e., beaten, that night.

My parents divorced when I was 14. (They're remarried now, to each other.) The SA that brought me here happened while my mom had custody of us right after the divorce. The perp was one of her co-workers. I can't imagine how I would tell my mother about it, so I can see why it's difficult to discuss with your parents what your sister did to you.

Sorry I don't have any ideas. I'll be watching this thread now, too.

Thanks,

Joe

 

[Wuamei]

Mike:

It also hurts me to have to keep the SA a secret. If they ever found out about what my sister did to me it would really hurt them and it would disrupt the family just too much. But it's unfortunately that they'll never know exactly what
I'm going through. If they had a clearer picture it would certainly help me a lot.

You're right it would. Do you really have to keep
silent? Your parents seem to really love you, being willing to go to therapy with you & all. Short-term, disclosing to them might be disruptive
but it sounds like your family is already pretty disrupted anyway. It might really help them
to know what you're going thru.

Having said that you sound pretty certain you can never tell them. Brother these are just some thots
for what they may or may not be worth from someone
who knows only what you've shared about your family situation.

My family situation is quite different. My parents
would never be so helpful; they not my sibling were my perps. So my dealings with my parents are quite different. I've dealt by cutting them off pretty much. You may or may not be able to or need to do that. Never felt close to anyone in my family (in the right ways that is)anyway.

So I just mention this stuff becuz I do from what you say see, in what you aptly describe as an "enmeshed family," signs of my own family. A whole dysfunctional family system of silence, coverup, misunderstanding, confusion, etc etc.

From what I've been reading, at least in the case of my mother, what was involved was emotional (as well as sexual) incest.

That's why I'm going to recommend at least looking
into a few books I've not read yet, tho I've read reviews, considerable excerpts, and related stuff by some of the authors:

Sibling Abuse Trauma: Assessment and Intervention Strategies for Children, Families, and Adults
by John V. Caffaro, Allison Conn-Caffaro

Sibling Abuse : Hidden Physical, Emotional, and Sexual Trauma by Vernon R. Wiehe
(Caution: one reviewer wrote: "This is an excellent book about this subject, which is admittedly a very difficult one to discuss. Unfortunately, the author felt obligated at one point to couch the discussion in terms of men's supposed need to control women -- despite the fact that many of the abusive siblings were female.")

What Parents Need to Know About Sibling Abuse
by Vernon R. Wiehe

The Brother/Sister Hurt: Recognizing the Effects of Sibling Abuse by Vernon R. Wiehe Ph.D., Euan Bear (Editor)

Perilous Rivalry: When Siblings Become Abusive
by Vernon R. Wiehe, Teresa Herring (Contributor)

When Parents Love Too Much: Freeing Parents and Children to Live Their Own Lives by Laurie Ashner, Mitch Meyerson (Contributor)

If You Had Controlling Parents : How to Make Peace with Your Past and Take Your Place in the World by Dan Neuharth

CUTTING LOOSE : AN ADULT'S GUIDE TO COMING TO TERMS WITH YOUR PARENTS by Howard Halpern

Adult Children of Abusive Parents: A Healing Program for Those Who Have Been Physically, Sexually, or Emotionally Abused by Steven Farmer
(This one I have read and it's good; covers all kinds of dysfunctional family situations.)

Toxic Parents: Overcoming Their Hurtful Legacy and Reclaiming Your Life by Susan Forward, Craig Buck (Contributor)

Emotional Blackmail: When the People in Your Life Use Fear, Obligation, and Guilt to Manipulate You
by Susan Forward (Author), Donna Frazier (Author)

Silently Seduced: When Parents Make Their Children Partners: Understanding Covert Incest
by Kenneth M. Adams

Emotional Incest Syndrome: What to Do When a Parent's Love Rules Your Life by Dr. Patricia Love, Jo Robinson (Contributor)

Children of the Self-Absorbed: A Grown-Up's Guide to Getting over Narcissistic Parents by Nina W. Brown

Trapped in the Mirror by Elan Golomb

Why Is It Always About You? : Saving Yourself from the Narcissists in Your Life
by Sandy Hotchkiss (Author)


Mike some of this is stuff I've been looking into for myself and may not have much to do with your situation. Anyway its here FYI. Hope some of it might be of some help.

TC & TTYL my friend.

Victor

 

[Lloydy]

Mike
My parents were similar to yours, neither of them could make a decision in what I would regard a 'normal' way ( whatever the hell that is ! ) but things just seemed to bumble along by some kind of apathetic magic. Most discussions were based around one or the other saying "oh just do it your way, that's what we always do !"

There was never any display of love between anyone in the family. They loved me and my brother I have no doubt, but within a space of 12 months I volunteered to go to boarding school and he emigrated to Canada.
Does that sound like a home we wanted to stay in ?

I was abused at school, out of the family, but I still couldn't tell them at the time. I think this was because I had no relationship with anyone in my family worth speaking of. And like yourself no "emotional guidance" either.
And this left me vulnerable to the abusers and incapable of speaking out to them.

It wasn't a lack of love from them at all, more a lack in their 'emotional structure'. And at the moment I am dealing with a family matter that dates back to my grandfather who died way before I was born. But from what I'm learning I have no doubt he passed nothing onto my mother. And I already know my fathers family were as bad.

The psychological principles of how and what we learn from our parents and peers is well established, and it takes a huge effort to break that that cycle if it's faulty or lacking.
But we're doing just that. I only wish I was young enough to have kids, because now I trust myself enough to make sure that the cycle is broken.

Dave

 

[guy43]

Mike,

To spill the beans or not is a most difficult question. In the long run, what do you have to lose if you do tell your folks about the abuse? What do you have to gain? You don't have to rush any decisions, but sooner or later you'll have to start doing, moving toward a goal, whatever.

I've found the 10 principles post most helpful, especially the item about being stuck: here\'s the link .

jer

 

[Mike Church]

Mike

Guy 43 is right. Look at the gains and losses and remember the single most important part of the equation is you yourself. Why should you have to live with it by yourself. Does that mean that your sister is without guilt in the family. You are part of that family too Mike. And you deserve the same consideration from the family.

I finally told my parents what had happened to me. What a load off my chest. The response was not what I wanted. "Why didnt you tell us". For gods sake I was a 16 year old confused boy. How can I tell mommy and daddy I was raped by three guys.

But I did tell them and am glad I did.
Just a thought brother wolf.

AAAAAAAAAAAWWWWWWWWWHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHOOOOOOOOOOOO

 

[Sleepy]

Thank you all for replying to this post. This issue has really been weighing down on me recently.

Dave,
It certainly sounds like our families are very similar. And, truthfully, it makes me happy to know that we've had a common background. There was on phrase that really stuck out:

apathetic magic

I really like that. In fact, if I ever become a famous rock star that's gonna be the name of my first album. It also sounds like a phrase coined by Elvis Costello. Seriously, though, my family has indeed bumbled along with some sort of apathetic magic. And unfortunatly after bumbling along I seemed to have found myself in some place where I really don't want to be.

The psychological principles of how and what we learn from our parents and peers is well established, and it takes a huge effort to break that that cycle if it's faulty or lacking.

So therein lies the problem. How do we break the cycle of our learned principals? I don't exactly know. But like you said, we are indeed doing that right now. One way or the other. And I'm certainly open to suggestions. BTW, this phrase also sounds like an abstract to a Ph.D. dissertation .

Vic,
Thanks for the book info. I actually have some of those. And I think I'm gonna print out the rest and take the list with me to the book store.

Jer,
I really like those principals. What is interesting is that last year I underwent a very large paradigm shift in my thinking. I use to never talk about my problems. I was too ashamed to talk. But I realized that that wasn't getting me anywhere. I never placed it in a list but shifting my awareness to the outside became a guiding principal to my life. Thanks Jer and thank you sonlight posting those.

Okay, here's my understanding of disclosure within my family: I think this issue of disclosure and enmeshment are are not separate issues for me. My sister, I believe, has never separated from the family either. When she was 18 she got pregnant and my folks ended up buying them a house that is less than a 1/8 of a mile away. Now she has a son and daughter that are 11 and 9, respectively. Because of the close distance the children freely go between the two houses. I completely understand why she never fully became detached from the family. It was difficult for her to raise two kids, go to school and hold down a house without my parents' help. So it naturally made her dependant on mom and dad. In a 'round about way she really never left home.

So if I was to disclose the SA it would be like an atom bomb exploding in the heart of the family. If my sister was living far off and being more independant, then perhaps I could consider it. But the fact remains that she is very close both physically and emotionally. I am also very close with my neice and nephew and the last thing I want to do is to jepordize those relationships. So it puts me in a tough situation. Like I said, I wish I could disclose but I think it would cause more harm than good. At least right now.

Thanks,
Mike

 

[Sleepy]

There is one other thing that I would like to say. About two months ago I did confront my sister about what she did to me. Surprisingly it went very well. She acknowledged it and was very sorry for doing it. I think it went well because I didn't direct my comments at her but rather at me. Overall it validated much of what I felt.

I just thought I should throw that in.
mike